Is there a god?

[Timmah!]

Legend11 said:

Timmah! said:

I'm going to present some logic as to why the existance of living things provides some proof that there is a god...

#1: When an archaeologist discovers a simple stack of bricks layed out in a pattern to form a wall, the scientific consensus is that intelligent life (namely human) created it. This is due to the fact that natural forces lead to chaos, not order. No scientist would argue that a brick wall (simple) or a house (complex) came from anything other than an intelligent being building it, as such an assumption would go against all the laws of nature.

#2: When scientists turn their radio telescopes to outer space, they are looking for any type of repeating, logical radio code to PROVE that their is intelligent life in outer space. Any simple code would be viewed by the scientific community as fairly solid proof of intelligent life. This is again due to the fact that the universe produces chaos and unpredictability by definition (without outside intervention).

All living things are made up of cells, the blueprint of which are DNA and RNA. Even the most simple cells have a very complex 'code' stored in the DNA, which is stored in the nucleus, that is then interpreted by the RNA to actually create the cells. So if it is impossible in science to have something as simple as a brick wall or a basic radio code created by anything other than intelligence, how is it that life, which is far more complicated than either of these examples, can be created without intelligent intervention? Because scientists don't want to believe in anything they can't explain, and they can't explain God so they've explained him away instead.

 

A high level of complexity doesn't necessarily mean that "intelligence" created it.

Take bacteria for example, there are complex mutations in some bacteria that have happened naturally.  Some of these mutations can be seen in the form of new untreatable infectious diseases (to go along with the untreatable infectious diseases caused by mutations created by antibiotics, etc). 

Another example of something complex not having an "intelligence" behind it is the Earth's climate system.  Some of the most powerful supercomputers in the World are involved in studying it even though there doesn't seem to be an "intelligence" that created it.

Basically what I'm trying to say is that complexity isn't necessarily evidence of an "intelligence" behind it.

 

No, but a high level of ORDERLY complexity does. That's my point. The universe is complex, but generally chaotic. The climate system of the earth is incredibly complex, but there's also a very high level of chaos and unpredictability associated with it. Just ask any weatherman.

I said nothing about mutations. Survival of the fittest is something that is very common. This is called Micro-evolution, or adaptions & changes within a species. This is a well documented and tested phenomenon. The point is not that living things can't undergo some changes from generation to generation, but that life cannot spontaneously form from a puddle of goo- that's what I'm saying.

Edit: The earth's ecosystem & climate are complex and chaotic, but there is also some order to it that points to intelligence. The moon is the exact size and distance from the earth to create the tides, keeping the oceans clean. Without that, life wouldn't be possible. The combination of temperature, the correct mix of gasses, the correct amount of particles in the air to create clouds, tilt of the earth to create seasons, etc all work together to form a perfect 'bubble' for life in a very inhospitable universe. The chance of one of these factors being correct by natural means alone isn't that far fetched- it's when you calculate the probability that ALL of them would be so exact in ONE place that chance begins to look very unlikely.