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DonFerrari said:

And then we go to the, does it have more unions because it have more wealth or is wealth created by unions?? I wouldn't bet on the second. And you were talking north versus south, not west vs east... and as far as I remember California is more to the south than to the north.

Try raising the taxes for corporations and see what happens, just to remember, even a self employed is a corporation for governments when they want to tax.

Where have they been successful? As far as I know several countries in europe (France being a big case) have failed really hard when doing tax on the wealth because they are either capable of evading by sending money to other countries or just leaving the country... and just to remember that is basically what happened to USA industry, wages and taxes escalated and jobs gone to Asia.

Socialism is a dream, it destroyed several countries, so for this we have empiric results of how it work in reality. So between individual negotiations (which I have been successfull so far) and socialism and leaving my power to another to use I choose the first.

It worked in the US and all over Europe, untill the elite decided to cut the wealthy heavy tax breaks. The taxes on companies keep dropping, if this trend carries on, more states will go bankrupt, the taxes must go up. If needed, property of companies fleeing should be confiscated.

Socialism lifted millions out of poverty and is responsible for a good standard of living anywhere. If individual negotiation would have historically been the norm, you and I would probably be poor.