Final-Fan said:
Shiken said:
Read your post and realize that your way of thinking is part of the problem. "Why did you generalize nonwhites as part of the problem?"
Oh please, anyone can see that it is directed to EVERYONE. However because I put the parentheses in a sentence between whites and non-whites, I have to be talking about one group. /s
BTW reread it. You have it flip flopped. If you are going to quote me to try to make a point, at least get the quote right. Also do not bring out one aspect of my post and ignore the rest. I never said to simply ignore it. I said everyone needs to shut up about it and just treat eachother as people instead of people of color. This will never happen if people are always taking about it, but we are too hard headed as a species to actually pull it off anyway.
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I think you've completely misunderstood what I was trying to say. I'll readdress the argument and try to do a more thorough job of explaining myself.
Your post that I was replying to:
Morgan Freeman said it best. Racism will not stop until we just stop talking about it. Until a Black man can look at a white man and vice versa and just see a man, it will never end. Everyone who is not white wants to play the victim (not literally everyone but you get it), and many whites want to pretend that racism is not a thing.
All races need to just shut up about the subject and see eachother as just men and women. No Black Pride, Asian Pride, Gay Pride, etc will ever get rid of racism. In fact, theh will only fuel it. This thread is a perfect example of that, just look at the title. The more you advertise it, the more people will talk about it. The more you talk about it the more racism will come out.
Everyone needs to just shut up and live as human beings. It really IS that simple. Unfortunately we are beings who over analyze every little thing to find SOMETHING to complain about. That in mind, racism will never end.
1. You said "everyone who is not white wants to play the victim", generalizing that all non-whites do this. Then you backtracked with your parenthetical statement, "(not literally everyone but you get it)". This is in contrast to the second part of the sentence, "many whites want to pretend that racism is not a thing". So when speaking about whites, you made a statement clearly indicating that many (but presumably not all) whites are part of the problem. However, when speaking about non-whites, you at first made a statement that was a sweeping generalization saying that all non-whites were part of the problem, and then had to walk it back to recognize that that clearly wasn't actually the case. I never said anything about you not directing your statement at both groups: I said that you talked about the two groups in different ways, and one of them was more over-generalized than the other. I decided to illustrate this fact for you by repeating back to you your statement but with whites more generalized than non-whites (the reverse of your original statement), which you misconstrued as me misquoting you.
2. You say that people should just shut up and treat each other right. That's fine as far as it goes. But if people aren't treating each other right, shouldn't they speak up? That's the conundrum that it seems to me that you are ignoring. If injustice exists, if people "just shut up" then they are ignoring the problem. But if they speak up, then the people who are perpetrating what other people see as the injustice (but which the ones doing it see as perfectly fine) are obviously going to pitch a fit. That is what I meant when I said "The more you talk about racism, the more racists get upset."
3. I think that pretty much addresses most of what you were saying in your post, so I don't believe I was "only bringing out one aspect of your post and ignoring the rest". I guess one thing that the above only touches on tangentially is your claim that talking about racial issues fuels racial divisions and hatred. Although I do believe the above does not ignore that issue, let me address it more directly here. While I do somewhat sympathize with that perspective, thoughtful people should be able to discuss the issue without inflaming hatred; and if there are already problems it's not realistic to think they can be solved without talking about them! What I think is often the case in these kinds of situations is ugly truths being revealed when those who are not being hurt by it would rather not have to look at it. Like there's a bunch of rotten food in the back of the refrigerator, and not only do you not want to be the one to have to clean it, you don't even want someone else to be cleaning it when you're there in the kitchen. And, to carry the analogy, some people are also arguing over whether the milk has really gone bad or not.
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1. Again, you have it reversed. I said non-white want to play the victim, then added the parentheses which directs the "some but not all" to my comment about NON-WHITES. Then I put a comma followed by a statement about the whites making it a completely new comment. Whether you realize it or not, you twisted something to what you expected me to mean due to a preconceived notion most likely fueled by the fact that this is a topic about race. My exact point in a nutshell.
2. That is not what I am saying. If someone is being mistreated, speak up. However this is a matter between the parties involved, not the whole damn country. When an issue like this grows countrywide (usually by media blowing things up and distortion of the truth), that is when things spread beyond the issue at hand and the situation worsens. At no point should anyone not stick up for themselves but as topic spreads past where it is relevant, that is when hate and racial assumptions come into play where they otherwise would have never been an issue.
3. There is a major difference between a few thoughtful people with a brain talking about an issue relevant to them and the media making it a distorted countrywide issue that causes problems. My problem is not with individuals talking amongst themselves or attempting to fix an issue relevant to their area, it is with the massive distortion of views when it goes beyond that.
Just to clarify, I am not mad at you or anything. It is just you are missing my point entirely and I am trying to clear things up a bit.
