11 officers shot, 1 bystander shot during protests over recent shootings

[Peh]

Nuvendil said:

SuperNova said:

I keep reading these kinds of statements regarding the correlation between gun violence and gun laws.

And while I don't think it's completely wrong I also think it is a little too short sighted. It seems to  imply that it's inherently easy to illegally obtain a gun. That might be true in US, but I think that is (at least in part) also due to the very liberal gun laws.

There's famously more guns in the US than people. A giant amount of guns that is so hard to keep track of, that it's easy for some people to have legally obtained guns fall off the grid and enter the black market. The sheer volume of guns in circulation probably makes it considerably easier to obtain an illegal one.

While it's true that even in a country with tight gun control like germany more gun crimes are perpetrated with an illegally obtained gun (40%) vs. legally obtained ones (5%), the biggest amount of gun crimes (50%) is still obtained with license free guns (gas pistols, bobby pistols etc.). Also the black market for guns is tiny and as such it is very hard for the average citizen, even a deranged one that want to shoot cops, to even illegally obtain a gun in the first place. As such, the overall gun crime percentage is only 0,2%. (Those 0,2% include threats made with bobby pistols and toy guns btw.)

I understand that historically guns have always been an important part of US culture, but to deny the benefits of tighter gun control is dangerous imo.

I'm not saying no new legislation should be put in place but people grossly oversimplify things.  And frankly, I would like to see us first actually enforce the laws we have - cause there are people with guns right now who shouldn't have them under the laws of their state.  And the illegal gun trade in the States is small partly because guns are so readily available.  My main point was that those determined to kill people in this manner, essentially completely throwing their lives away, will find a way.  Cause another aspect people often overlook is that no two countries are alike.  The United States is, for better and worse, enormous in size and population and policing it in all aspectsis more complex than most countries, which is something that must be considered when constructing regulations for something like fire arms and how it might inflate the illegal gun trade.  Personally, I think a good start would be to 1) charge those who sell guns to permitted individuals liable for crimes committed with the gun (so, for example, if these punks were unpermitted charge the seller with negligence or even negligent homicide) and 2) require a presentation of a psychological evaluation (obviously from a certified private professional) when applying for a permit to carry a weapon that confirms you are stable and suffer from no dangerous psychological conditions.  That would take legal weapons out of the hands of most of these loons.

And this is why I don't understand the US mentality. If someone is ready to cause mayhem, why do I give him the option to arm himself up to his teeth. You will have these kind of people in every society on this planet. What you can do is to make it difficult for them as far as possible so they can't take many lives. Try going on a amok with just a knife. You won't get that far. But if people have access to submachine guns and the like, the kill count will be obviously higher. Preventing it by arming the other side also with guns is just ridiculous.  Stricter gun controls and registration should be common sense aswell as psychological tests for the people who own a gun. 

If you are determined to get a gun and have the knowledge to do so, then you will eventually get one. But the risk of getting caught will also be higher due to higher controls.