Was Super Mario 64 Miyamoto's Greatest Achievement?

[Veknoid_Outcast]

Johnw1104 said:

Veknoid_Outcast said:

OK, now that I'm full of pizza and lemonade, I can comment :)

First of all, great work with the OP. You really spent a lot of time and effort explaining and defending your thesis - something I appreciate a lot.

Second of all, if we go by your criteria, Ocarina would have to be exempt. As much as I love it, Ocarina drew inspiration from Super Mario 64. Plus, while Miyamoto was director on Super Mario 64, he was more of a producer In Ocarina, overseeing several other parties.

So then it falls to the following three games: Super Mario Bros., The Legend of Zelda, and Super Mario 64 - all of which are probably among the top ten most influential games ever made.

All are excellent choices. Super Mario 64 led the great migration from 2D sprites to 3D polygons. Super Mario Bros. made Nintendo a household name and pretty much introduced the modern video game industry.

But I think I have to give it to The Legend of Zelda. Like Donkey Kong and Super Mario Bros., The Legend of Zelda was years ahead of its time.  When it arrived in 1986 it set the standard for open world, non-linear gameplay on consoles, and would go on to influence generations of action-adventure games. Through its pioneering use of a backup battery, it allowed players to experience an enormous game world that needn't be completed in a single setting.

I cannot fault your logic, and the original Zelda is yet another possible choice that I weighed (which is why I put it in the poll).

Really, when speaking of games that seemed completely unique, I think the three best titles of Miyamoto would probably be Legend of Zelda, Mario 64, and Pikmin. In regards to being groundbreaking, ahead of its time, and influential, that does seem to narrow down just to the original Zelda and Mario 64. If it weren't for games like Pitfall II, Jungle Hunt, and the first Mario Brothers, I'd be more comfortable putting Super Mario Bros there... really, it's a night and day difference so it may indeed be on that short list.

The one thing I feel separates Mario 64 from the others was the sheer difficulty of finding a way to make that game work. For instance, think back to all the gen 5 3D games that weren't even platformers but merely adventure games or something of the sort; they were often borderline impossible to control and played horrendously. That Miyamoto found a way to produce a charming, 3D title in the super-precise platforming genre in 1996 is, to me, almost a miracle.

That's really where my reasoning comes from: When viewed in its greater context, I can hardly understand how they pulled off what they did with Mario 64. It seems so obvious now when you look at that game, but when you compare it to those 3D titles that released without the benefit of having Mario 64 as a guideline, it's clear a minor miracle was achieved there lol

Like I said though, I don't fault your choice at all. I made this thread specifically because I hovered between a few different options and realized it was a great topic for debate... I would have explained my stance on Super Mario Bros, Legend of Zelda, Ocarina, Galaxy etc, but I knew the post had grown so long already that many would skip it and go straight to the poll lol

Well said. I think you can make a convincing case for Super Mario Bros., The Legend of Zelda, and Super Mario 64.

And I take well your point about level of difficulty. There were templates out there for The Legend of Zelda, most notably in Ultima. But Miyamoto and company really needed to start from scratch with Super Mario 64. It's remarkable that, in its first attempt to transform a 2D side-scrolling platformer into a 3D open-area platformer, Nintendo succeeded, and, what's more, made a masterpiece in the process.

@poll: it's a little depressing that OG Zelda is currently being beaten by "asshats are hats for asses."