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Ballas on 07 May 2016
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DivinePaladin said:
Ballas said:

Best in genre is VERY subjective, don't state it as if its an undeniable truth, its not.

I played Bayonetta, the first one, and I would put DMC, GOW and MGR as having better gameplay and some of them having better level design and pacing as well. All of them have a much better story.

MGR and DMC have just as nonsensical stories; the difference is that Bayonetta and MGR don't take themselves seriously in doing so, compared to later DMC games. To say the pacing or  story in a DMC game is good is laughable, considering it's just about as self-indulgent!

 

As for gameplay, there's no argument to be had here. Bayonetta 1 came out of nowhere and perfected a genre that at that point was growing stagnant. GoW, by comparison, is one of the simpler hack and slash games, and Bayonetta absolutely trounces MGR and DMC in nuance. If you haven't gotten that you simply haven't played the game enough. You can prefer one series to another. THAT is subjective. When I say "best in the genre," I'm referring to the insane variety in the mechanics, weapons, dodges, cancels, enemy design, and so on. There's so much depth that  it's absolutely nuts, even compared to other games in the genre. Nothing comes close to Bayonetta in that regard; the closest is a distant DMC, which makes sense since it was designed by mostly the same team. 

GOW's combat is simple yet effective, but there's a hidden depth to it that you have to unlock when playing in the highest difficulty setting. Try playing it, its a very different experience than playing GOW games on normal or hard mode.

KLXVER said:
Ballas said:

Ofc no. I think the new DMC is good but Bayonetta was better. Really though, now that I think about it, only DMC 3 is better than Bayonetta in the entire series xD

But my point about GOW and MGR stands true, I think Bayonetta is better than the first GOW but not as good as the rest and with MGR I think Platinum really outdid themselves, had so much fun with that game even though its ridiculously short.

Its fine that you like GOW more than Bayonetta, I just hope youre not saying that the combat in GOW is deeper.
Wyrdness said:
Ballas said:

MGR isn't a series but for GOW I think GOW II, GOS and III all have better gameplay, pacing, level design and story. COO was overall a better game. Bayonetta has got a smooth and great combat system, so combat wise I'd say its as good or slightly better than GOW III which had the best combat in it series. In terms of boss fights its better than some and worse than some.

But MGR and DMC 3 have better combat than Bayonetta. That said other DMC games are also better in some ways, though worse overall.

I've played all those games and tbh B1 and B2 have combat that is overall well above those other games, only DMC3 comes close to them as combat while the enhanced editions of the original Ninja Gaiden on Xbox are also not far off. MGR's problem are the enemies and the some what smaller range of depth in approach compared to the other games, it's far easier to slash away in MGR but when it comes to going into depth it's mechanics and their uses are not only in a smaller range than the other games but don't allow as much differentiation in approach.

DMC3 I can see where you're coming from but it's a different approach, DMC3 you pick a style that gives you unique tricks and you get creative with the tricks while in the Bayo games you have a massive system where you determine the combos you have access to as well as the style in approach to combat through your 2 weapon sets and accessories and then you play around with the other mechanics of the system on top of them like a sand box. Many people funny enough aren't even aware of all the mechanics in these games and I'm speaking from the POV as an avid follower of the genre who follows the community that explores the mechanics. DMC3 has plenty of variety the problem is it falls short because you can't fully mix up the system like you can in the Bayo game as it's only one style at a time and mechanics outside of the styles are limited.

No offence but I wouldn't even put the GOW series near the other games when it comes to combat, the only game that has a system that comparably can be played around with as much as the Bayo games is DMC4 when playing as Dante or Vergil but the weapon choices in the game are far more limited and again the enemies offer weak resistance to high level players. Ninja Gaiden funny enough when it comes to clashing with enemies is the series that gives both Bayonetta games a run for its money as like in the latter games NG actually feels like you're engaged with formiddable enemies who can deal with you and you can't just attack mindlessly.

Most technical action games in their mechanics are W101 and Transformers: Devastation.

I never said that did I? The combat in GOW is great but look at my post, I said Bayonetta's combat is as good or better than the combat in the best GOW game. That said the puzzles, pacing and level design together elevate GOW's gameplay beyond that of Bayonetta.

Besides I also like GOW's unique approach of having different weapons not all accessed at one time, each weapon feels much more useful on its own than in the other games. The enemy variety is huge and waves are mixed up so you have to use different tactics.

In DMC 3 you can mix the weapons into a huge combo if you have the skills. Different approach to combat but I like it more. MGR's combat allows great levels of freedom due to its design. Bayonetta offers lots of options too but DMC 3 had a massive amount of variety.