Could the Human Race really be the Aliens on this planet??

[JWeinCom]

Dulfite said:

JWeinCom said:

Whatever people believe started evolution, what start that? And I've heard/read so many differnet theories, including the one on the universe expanding/contracting infinetely, but I say again to that and to all other theories as to why things are the way they are, what caused them in the first place if there isn't God? Seriously, I want a serious response to this. Every other time people just blow past that question because they either don't know or they don't want to answer.

I'm just going to focus in on this part.  

You're not talking about evolution.  Evolution started when life originated.  Anything before that falls into the category of either abiogenesis or cosmology. 

Once life originates in whatever way it does, then we have a pretty good idea of how it grows and changes over time.  Evolution is logical because we know that genes exist and we know how they work.  Evolution is gene changes in a population over a certain period of time.  And we can see this happening in humans over the course of human history, in species we've domesticated, and in labarotories with fruit flies and bacteria.  Evolution is the cornerstone of biology, and biology has proven itself over and over in practical application.  So, we know how evolution happens. 

As  for how life and the universe started, the answer is we don't know.  And what is wrong with that answer exactly? You're demanding a serious answer to how the universe was created from a random guy on a message board.  And the answer is I don't know.  It's honest, and it's accurate.  There are many theories as to how this is possible, and they're a bit too complex to sum up here.  I would recommend watching Lawrence Krauss' presentation, A Universe From Nothing, or reading Stephen Hawking's "The Grand Design" if you're truly interested.

But let's say that nobody had any clue.  Then the answer is just I don't know.  We don't get to insert an intelligence into the equation, because that just pushes the problem back one level, and we have to figure out where that intelligence came from.  And of course, if you want to propose god as a theory to be taken seriously, then you need some actual evidence.  You can believe whatever makes sense to you, but unless you have evidence don't try to convince others. Or at least don't try to convince me.

And, again, that has nothing to do with evolution.  Just because we don't know how life starts doesn't mean we don't know what happens once it's here.

1) I don't push people into my beliefs. I do not believe anyone would accept Jesus Christ as their savior if they were forced to instead of having their heart change. I was just curious so I was just pushing for a response to my question (of which you gave me and I thank you).

2) Really, when I say evolution, I'm talking about anything changing. I was more saying macro evolution (how the universe itself changes).

3) Why do genes work the way they do? Why are their genes in the first place? Either there is a purpose for them, which points to something deciding that there needed to be a purpose, or there isn't a purpose, in which case they shouldn't exist at all.

4) Inserting an intelligence into the equation can resolve the issue. If I believe in God, I awknowledge that I do not understand things the way HE does. I awknowledge that one day I will understand a great deal more, however:

1.  I wasn't accusing you of anything.  I was addressing your use of god as an explanation for creation.

2.  In that case, you're just not using the right terminology, and it's going to get confusing.  Evolution means something really specific in science.  There is a word for how the universe itself changes, and that word is cosmology.  If you're using the terms interchangeably, you're not going to be understood.

3.  I don't know why they need any kind of purpose to exist.  But as for why there are genes (this is called abiogenesis), we have a decent idea.  Genes are made of amino acids, and we have been able to produce these in a lab without any pre-existing life.  So when you get certain molecules together in certain places, it is likely possible for life to exist.  See the Miller Urey experiments.

As for why genes do what they do, there is a really long explanation, but the much shorter one is that they're chemicals.  And chemicals act in certain ways according to the laws of chemistry. In nature we see even non-living things such as crystals (which some people actually think may have something to do with the origin of life) that replicate themselves.  So, yeah.  When you get certain molecules together, they replicate.  And, when those molecules have an imperfect method of replicating, they changes.  

If you're really and genuinely interested in this topic, there are a lot of books and lectures that can explain it better than me.  These aren't unanswerable questions, and we've got some pretty strong ideas.

4.  It resolves the issue in the same way that flipping over a chess board resolves a game of chess.  It's an answer that doesn't have any evidence to support it, and it raises more questions than it answers.  

You're asking a lot of questions when it comes to scientific explanation, which is a good thing.  But, you don't seem to be applying the same scrutiny to the idea of a creator.

Where did this creator come from?  What purpose was behind his creation?  Why did he want to create the universe?  What mechanisms can he use to create the universe?

If you want an answer that actually answers the questions, then an intelligence does not help.  We simply don't have a compelling answer yet, and we need to keep looking.  Maybe that search will turn up an intelligence of some sort, but we have no evidence for one now.