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Wonktonodi on 27 March 2015
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sc94597 said:
Wonktonodi said:


1. Hypothiticals are fun, What if they just want a wedding cake to order? It's not the amount of involment that bothers these people it's that it's a gay wedding. Yet other instances of things that should be against their religious views don't stop them from doing business?  The popular culture anti gay religious views aren't the same as those with deep religious beleives. It's people picking and chossing parts to follow and the decrimination in the name of religion, is just trying to defend biogtry with a popular religion, not actually convictions.

The church would be where the ceremonial part takes place, they already only aloow those of that religion to take part. and being a member and being aple to used the ceremonial part isn't the same as, renting out halls from a church or other facility, those usually have prperty mangers who deal withthat anyway keeping the Church mroe seperate from the buiness side of renting out the building anyway.

2. Stupid slogan, though still acctate. It's the anti descrimination law that you should bring up though because that's the one that people were suing over. Marriage equality laws and court actions aren't the same as anti discrimanatory laws. Expecting the free market to take care of discrimination is a vaire naieve. 

 

1. Are they actually commiting the sins (or do they believe they are) in those other cases? You were providing a lot of hypothetical statements in your posts as well. Does it really matter whether or not it is the same as other people's religious views? They are religious views nevertheless. Why do the views even have to be religious? Why can't people refuse to do something based on their personal morals and ethic system? I know many non-relgious homophobes.  

Many churches have refused to do weddings for gay couples. Hell, there was a recent case where a church refused a black couple (minister performed the ceremony at another church.) 

http://abcnews.go.com/US/mississippi-church-rejects-black-wedding/story?id=16878536

2. That is your opinion. As a gay person, I think the slogan has benefitted the movement greatly. My point was that such religious people view things like this as a consequence of legalizing gay marriage, and therefore can use it to create laws like this one or they might not support gay marriage laws in their states, due to a growing animosity. Obviously the demand from this law isn't a because a small minority of people supported it. If it passed it was because it was the sentiment of a lot of people in the state it passed in. Also, expecting the government to take care of people who are discriminated against is even more naive, because it was the government that was responsible for much of the discrimination in history. 

1. Yes I am aware I was putting in hypotheticals, however you were getting it to the point where you make it sound like the bakery is the wedding planner. I know churches can refuse wedding, on the flip side there were gay wedding at churches long before it legal under the law.

The big questions. 1. Does it really matter whether or not it is the same as other people's religious views? not all religions are recognised and some states tried to ban other religious laws. 2. Why do the views even have to be religious?  well acourding to the new law in Indiana they do. 3. Why can't people refuse to do something based on their personal morals and ethic system?  While many people can refuse service to anyone, it's why and how they do it that can be the issue. When you have established a business in our society there are pocedures you need to go through and rules you have to follow. Or there can be legal repricussions. There are ways for pepole who want to refuse to do things based on their own personal beleif systems, stay outside the system that doesn't allow for them to discriminate based on them.

2. Gay here as well, still think it was stupid. Yes they might view it as a cosequence of gay marrage but it's still a serarate issue. Yes desire for the law didn't come out of nothing, but it's still going through a legislature and not from the people.

I don't expect the government to take care of the oppressed I demand it, I fight for it sometimes things go well sometimes not. Prop 8 passed here in CA in 2008 by the will of the people but the courts are what struck it down. Yes governments have also done much wrong, but there are tools there that are more efective than boycott after boycott pressuring one busineess after another. Especially when sometime now there is a market for those who do descriminate.