"Actually sir, the above is indeed a proven fact. We have documented the rise of new species with completely new features from parent species that are 100% incompatible in almost every way with their ancestors. We have seen this not only morphologically like in the Galapogos island birds but also in DNA. Furthermore, we ourselves, come from a ancestral species that is now extinct and there were other forms of "humans" that were strikingly different from us at different points in time as shown by fossile records. There is proof that these sister lineages were indeed intelligent but we simply do not know why they went extinct however some of them did indeed look like other more "primal" mammals such as apes but they were not apes and they used tools." -marc 1. I adore your politness even if its intent isn't so kind or rather condesending. 2. Please then, prove me the 100% Fact of the evolution of one species to another. Show me the missing link that would prove your point. 3. You don't believe that another kind of animal would have developed a brain that wasn't evolved or preevolved or evolutionarily related to humans? Just curious. "The above makes no sense sir. I am not a gambling man and I believe that gambling is in itself a very bad (perhaps even evil) habit. The more likely scenario regarding why we are similar is because we evolved. Also, when I think about my brain the idea of soul never even enters my mind. This is something that is taught in religion as a means of staying alive after death because people are so afraid of death. I dont want to die any more than anyone else but I am not going to cheapen my life by believing in something out of that fear. There is no such thing as a "soul." This is a human creation to make ourselves feel better about ourselves. Our minds are a result of evolution to protect our bodies. Simple as that. People make the mistake of thinking that our bodies are here to protect us (our minds or our souls)... this is not true. It is the other way around and has been in all documented life. The existence of brain and senses is to keep our bodies alive and healthy which is where our innate reflexes come from. We just happen to have a much higher brain function and it is that which is helping us thrive in the world but as I said above, other human species were not so lucky for whatever reason. We even retain many other odd reflexes that make no sense to have whatsoever. Have you ever heard of the "divers reflex?" This reflex comes from the fact that we were derived from animals that are marine because we sure as hell dont have any use for it ourselves but it is something very important to sea animals so explain to me why this is in our design? Did God just want to cut corners and left that in there out of laziness? Did he run out of time? Or maybe he wanted us to live underwater then changed his mind mid design? Or wait.. maybe one day all humans will become marine and we will all live under the sea with Shamu the little mermaid... we are royally screwed if thats the case however." -marc 1. i'm loving your comedy, it brightens things up i should say. 2. You and me have different thoughts now do we? You feel we are just highly evolved beasts of nature right? And i believe that we are Natural Beings of Reason. We are seperated from the beasts of the earth, so much that the things that we can do are hardly considered natural. We have a sense of reason, thought beyond mind and matter, not for the benifit for our bodies, but for the benifit for of ourselves. What good is fear for our bodies? What good is the capacity to overcome fear for our bodies? What good is it to think beyond the Universe for our bodies? In fact, for me the whole point is to overcome my body. Overcome peversion, overcome hunger, overcome thirst, overcome doubt, overcome all the things of the flesh for the things of the spirit. The Flesh is for the Spirit and that is my answer to you. We think differently, and that's ok. But don't think your right to come and bash other people's beliefs. That gets close to ignorance. And sir, to talk about God that way, is complete foolishness. You obviously don't see God the way i do. * ugh i'm tired. I guess i'll have to finish my thoughts later. But please, don't let your flesh control you. When you have control over your flesh, that your spirit, which is you, your soul, (your soul is you, your spirit is the mind of your soul) you'd be able to see life in a whole new (and most likely better) way. And I'm not saying for you all to be Christians (which would be so awesome), but i'm saying not to get lost in Science. Let Science and Nescience, the Physical and Spiritual, hte Scientist and the reverend co-exist. It's not impossible. |
1 - Aye it meant to be that way. Look back at the post and look who put down who. Namely look at my 1st post then your reply to it.
2 - i did give you clear examples in the 1st paragraph that you have conveniently not included in the quotes. To re-iterate so you dont have to look them up. Galapagos Island Birds are a well known and easily internet researchable example of populations that diverge and create new species due to environmental factors. If you want to see something more obvious, look at turtles and tortoises (lots of interesting things there and you can see it easily). DNA can easily be manipulated in smaller species (that we understand and have mapped) to create new species that produce specific molecules we want them to make (heck we were doing this even before we had gene mapping... insulin anyone?). The study of Embryology ties all the above together very nicely as does a general overview of world ecology. Where is your proof and is there any of any kind aside from your own emotional feelings?
3 - I am not sure what your question is asking. Are you asking whether or not I think other animals can have a brain like our own? If so, we know there were other species of Homo that are extinct thus it is undenyable. Or are you asking me if i think that it is impossible that anything else could develop a high functioning brain? I dont know why you would ask that however when I am making a pro-evolution argument. Please clarify the question for me.
---section 2---
1 - Same as above
2a - But we are not that seperated at all. Even among living species we are incredibly similar to apes. If you look at the fossil records you also note that we are not the only species of homo to exist. Other species with similar brain function did indeed exist and they aparently knew how to use tool and communicate like we do. We just dont know why they are extinct now. One idea is that we killed them and another is there was some kind of super disease they couldnt resist. Who knows what happened to other homo's (no pun intended...) but we are not unique and it is not out of the question that our own species might diverge if faced with some kind of event like a super disease or higher levels of radiation or even a something like a beneficial mutation.
2b - Well the difference between your opinion and my own is that mine has some fact attached to it while yours is just widely supported but for no other reason than tradition.
Our ability to do things beyond what seems to be useful for our body is simply a byproduct of our higher brain function but it isnt just that simple. Think about this for a second. Our ability to think outside the "box" (if you will) gives us a huge evolutionary advantage. The ability to look and understand physics, the ability to make tools, the ability to fantasize, the ability to communicate. All these things give us a huge undenyable advantage over the forces of natural selection because they ultimately help us survive as a species. In other words, our high functioning brains CAN indeed be attributed to the natural result of evolution (and much more likely than design) and thus the things we do are indeed natural as well because it is precisely those things that help us survive. Seems to me that higher brain function is indeed the next logical step in evolution on this planet given the state of other animals of our own scale around us (in terms of size). You can try to seperate yourself from your body all you like, but whether you like it or not, even religion is a natural form of survival that has helped us survive in the past by bringing individuals together to solve common problems. As funny as this sounds after all this bickering, we need all the religions and different beliefs so that we can survive as a species. All these things are just a highly evolved form of defense.
