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Danman27 on 24 February 2014
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Zkuq said:
Danman27 said:

No, MP is not always added value. A perfect example of that is spec ops the line. I was annoyed by the argument of you implying every single MP is tacked on. And yes, you did make it sound like that. My other arguments were stating that it's clear that a game's quality in SP can still go up after online is added, and it usually does. And they idea that it's always good when a dev chooses to not include multiplayer. I think that any game can have a fantastic MP if done correctly. If they aren't going to, I agree that it might as well be left out. But if done correctly, any game can. I think infamous could have a great comptetitive. The order looked like it was going to be an awesome coop mode at first (and don't say you couldn't totally see that from the launch trailer). And many onlines that you probably have written off were awesome. The wall scaling in uncharted on line was super fun and new. I think that MP needs to somehow reflect one of the major aspects of the single player. If done so correctly it's great. That's my argument. I find it annoying that many peole assume online is tacked on. 

I never implied that all MP is tacked on. I took special care to never say so, even though I didn't take special care to ensure you don't get that impression. I never got the impression from your post that SP quality can go up thanks to added MP, although I imagine it can be true in some rare cases. And I agree, any game can have a fantastic MP mode if done correctly. I also think that for many games, correctly doing that requires not just some effort but a huge effort becomes some games are better suited for SP and coming up with a proper MP mode might be difficult.

As for the games you specifically mentioned, I can't really say much. inFamous could have some potential but it would also require a bit of creativity to be worth the effort IMO. I couldn't see anything from The Order launch trailer because I didn't watch it. :P As for Uncharted, core MP gameplay seemed to be pretty much the usual DM/TDM/CTF with climbing, and I think that in the big picture, it didn't add very much to the basic plan. For me, Uncharted was much more than a shooter yet the MP modes focused on the shooting part and climbing thing was just a small addition to that, and that's why I didn't like it so much. I definitely agree, though, that MP should somehow reflect SP.


If you weren't trying to imply, it certainly sounded like it. And I didn't mean it adds to the single player  (even though some do a little bit). What I meant was, a multiplayer element needs to be built around the  core element that makes the game unique. If not, then it is just another generic turd online. But I think a surprising number of devs do a good job at this. 
And I agree that inFamous having a good online would require creativity. But isn't creativity what inspires innovation? More games need to do new things.

Ps. Can't believe an argument online might actually end with the two parties coming to an agreement.