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landguy1 on 02 August 2013
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ratchet426 said:
landguy1 said:
ratchet426 said:
endimion said:
ratchet426 said:

""When you've got a learning neural network..."


OMFG, please... learning neural network my @ss. This whole MS Cloud business is so over the top b.s. it isn't even funny. There is NO WAY current (and forseeable future) internet bandwidth could support anything close to real-time or even near real-time CPU processing. This is nothing but shameless marketing to the clueless masses who are eating it up as some kind of belevolent SkyNet "learning" super Cloud.

So MS has improved their multiplayer server infrastructure. That's nice, good for them. I'm sure it's on par with Gaikai.  Doesn't make either one of them some magical "learning neural network" that can offload AI logic and processing from the console. Wake the F up people.

 

 


good then... cause nothing about drivatar and cloud offload from forza happens in real time... maybe next time before you try too hard you should be informed about the subject at end.... and i don't know about you but 20 years ago we had kbps connection in less than 20 i will gbps connection and low latency... you world must really suck....

and gakai infrastructure has been/is/ an will always be a joke behind MS cloud infrastructure, which is the second biggest in the world behind AWS from amazon... so before talking about people eating marketing crap, stop blowing dry sony joke of cloud spinoff streaming service  that has nothing close to a cloud Computing structure like azure has.... and doesn't need to be proven.... it's been a decade already that MS amazon google oracle have been using, exploiting, and dominating cloud technologies....

Oh...well at least you have a well thought out (and written) argument. I stand corrected.

...

So anyway, as I attempt to follow your sophmoric and grammatically-challenged attempt to school me on all things cloud-related, perhaps you can answer this for me: If, as you claim, "nothing about drivator and cloud offload happens in real time" then how can it possibly offload "20%" of the XBone's CPU for other tasks, like this developer was claiming? If it isn't real time AI processing in the cloud, then what the hell good is it? Last time I checked, Forza 5 wasn't a turn-based role playing driver game, its real time.

Although i believe M$ and other companies do offload cpu usage to the cloud, i have no direct knowledge of how it is done technically.  You seem to be correct, that it has to be real time for it to matter while driving around in Forza to matter.  I just know that when we were upgrading our servers in my office, we had an option to go with a server that was half as powerful because the cloud service was going to take up the cpu slack somehow.  We didn't go with it, because the charges for the cloud service would have paid for the more expensive server in 18 months...


Landguy1-

Amazon's EC2 (Elastic compute cloud) Microsoft's Azure, Rackspace, Terramark, etc all offer cloud based computing in the form of virtual servers that are hosted within their phyiscal data centers around the world. You essentially pay a monthly fee per virtual server in their cloud. These cloud based servers are just that - a "standalone" virtual server that you administer just like a physical server to run applications, databases, etc. Gaikai is an extensive cloud computing infrastructure designed primarily for streaming games, but the games run on the virtual servers in the cloud and the graphics get streamed to your console, with bi-directional controller input. Kind of like an interactive YouTube or Netflix on steroids.

However, the cloud service that MS is claiming for Xbox One, and the AI offload processing that the Forza 5 developer was talking about is not some some number of discrete virtual servers running a separate application to support the game - like hosting multiplayer gaming sessions. They're claiming that the XBox is able to __offload CPU cycles__ to the cloud and thus reclaim local CPU cycles to use for better graphics, etc. Essentially a cloud-based CPU co-processor. 

**This type of high-speed, low-latency CPU offloading is simply NOT POSSIBLE with current Internet speeds!!** Hell, you can't even do it with multiple 10Gbps fiber optic links between 2 servers in the same data center. Sure you can transmit data back and forth really fast, but actually offloading CPU cycles in reall time requires bandwidth and latency tolerances several orders of magnitude better than what consumers can get from even the fastest residential Internet providers.

This whole "Power of the Cloud" bulls**t from Microsoft is just marketing spin, smoke, and mirrors. It WILL NOT magically make the XBox One 600% faster.

I guess that i understood the concept of it as you have explained(better than i have seen explained or even in debate in other threads).  THat's kind of why i said that it seems hard to believe that they can really affect gaming in real time.  I guess, based on your explanation, it seems that it is currently BS.  Maybe, M$ has a plan or system that is somehow similar to Gaikai in some way?  You would like to think that there is something to their "cloud Power" hype.  I think that they will continue to reveal more info about it as we go, or they will need to just drop the HYPE about it all together.  We will have to wait and see over the next 3 months.