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theprof00 said:
Adinnieken said:
theprof00 said:
Adinnieken said:
In what should be absolutely no surprise to anyone. The whole reason why Microsoft made the move to Microsoft Points was because it was cheaper. By using a common currency and selling that currency world-wide in local denominations, Microsoft was able to avoid having to pay credit card fees.

So, yeah I could easily see price increases of 3% to cover the cost of credit card transaction fees. Not to mention, there'll likely be exchange rate fees that are figured into the costs.

Nope. Not surprised that MS is raising prices.

Also, MS doesn't pay those CC transaction fees. Remember, MS sells to distributors, and distributors sell to stores. Stores always pay transaction fees associated with purchases made through CC. There is literally no difference in moving from points to currency. Everything is still bought and paid for the same way.

Surprised? You still shouldn't be. The only thing that has changed is that you pay more.

EDIT: Oh wait, there is one change now, I guess, now you can't go on Ebay and buy 25$ worth of points from America and pay for it using a strong currency. That's gone.

1 Um on Xbox LIVE Microsoft pays those fees.  We're talking Xbox LIVE.

2Also Microsoft Point cards had an MSRP.  1600 MP = $20, however they also had margin.  Meaning Microsoft, as well as Nintendo, sold their cards to retailers for less than the face value.  So while YOU paide $20 for 1600 MP card, the retailer only might have paid $15.00.  Subsequently, they have a 30% margin.

3So yes, the retailer may have paid a CC fee if you paid with a CC, but that only cut into their margin. 

4Microsoft stated back in 2000 or 2001 when it announced its plans to go with it's own virtual currency, that the two reasons it did was because of exchange fees and credit card fees.  And the stated problem with those thing things was that both drove up the cost of content.

1 Yeah, so nothing has changed. You do know that users still had to pay with their cc to buy points through LIVE
2 Yeah, and there won't be a difference here, either. The cards will say 20$, the retailers will pay 18$, the distributors 17$.
3 Right, so nothing has changed.
4 *shakes head* You do know that the whole reasoning behind it was that MS would rather have you pay 20$ one time, than 5$ four times.
It saves them roughly 50 cents or so...and yet, they'll still be selling the dollar value cards, and will likely have you purchase in quantities on LIVE.

They still pay the same percentage, it's just now they'll be skipping the smaller charge, which is usually about 10-15 cents for a big retailer.
So even if you spent that 20$ buying 20 1$ items, the most they'll lose out on is about 5%, meanwhile, your cost went up 35%.
And trust me, there are still ways to push sales around, like not expensing until the end of the month, and other tactics like simply holding your cc info, so they can collect all at one time.

It's not rocket science.

1.  If you used a credit card to pay for Microsoft Points on Xbox LIVE, yes, Microsoft absorbed that credit card fee.  Again, the MAJORITY of consumers did NOT use Microsoft to purchase their Xbox LIVE Points through.  They used retail cards.  Yes, you could easily pay $20 for a 1600 Microsoft Point card, but you could also pay $17.00 for that card on sale.  Thus, if you bought your Microsoft Points through Microsoft you paid more for them than if you purchased them through retailers.  So, from a consumer perspective Microsoft Points were a value proposition.

2.  No, it isn't the same.  As with Sony, a $20 card cost the retailer $20.  The whole reason why Microsoft and Nintendo sold their cards at wholesale was to ensure retailers would carry them.  Sony encountered resistence because retailers don't make any money on a $20 Sony card.  Also, there are no distributors involved.  Microsoft, Nintendo, and Sony all sell directly to the retailer and supply them directly.  There is no wholesaler.  In order to ensure the ability to guarantee payment, they own the process.  From manufacturing, stamping, pressing, to retail.  This is why Microsoft, Nintendo, and Sony all take a chunk of each game sale.  The own and manage the entire process.

3.  Again, see above.  The card now will cost the retailer $20, not $15.  The retailer loses margin, so they no longer have the room to sell it at a discount.  If someone buys it on a credit or debit card, they take an automatic 3% loss.  There is now less incentive for retailers to carry cards for Xbox LIVE purchases.

4.  Again, no.  The biggest issue Microsoft had with using local currency is the fact every non-US transaction would incur an exchange fee.  If I buy Microsoft Poiints via Amazon.co.uk, in the UK, my £34 pays for 5200 Microsoft Points.  If I use a credit card, yes Amazon still pays that fee, but because Amazon UK is selling them and  I'm paying for the Microsoft Points card in GBP there is no exchange fee. 

Microsoft offers Microsoft Points online as a means of convencience, not because it's the better value.  The fact that Major Nelson highlights sales at retail for subscription cards and Microsoft Point cards should be a clue that Microsoft understands that the better value IS retail. 

I agree, it isn't rocket science, but it requires more knowledge of how things actually work than you possess.  You know nothing of how exchange works, you obviously know nothing about how console manufacturers own the process. 

This is my fucking problem.  People like this that actually think they know what they're fucking talking about but don't.  I'm sorry TheProf, you don't.  If something costs Microsoft more money, guess what it's going to cost consumers more money.  That's just the way it works.  In an effort to keep costs low for things like DLC and other online content, Microsoft came up with their virtual currency to avoid those costs directly influencing online prices.  Yes, if you bought 1600 Microsoft Points via Microsoft, you paid more than you could potentially pay at retail.  Likewise with subscription cards.

Not to mention, the red tape involved with taxation.  If the MSRP for the content doesn't go up for me, the final price will because now I have to pay taxes on that purchase.  I avoided it before, I can't now.  Before, Microsoft Point cards were untaxed.  Now, because every transaction is in real currency, I'll pay taxes.

Microsoft Points were better for gamers.  They might not have been as concvenient as using local currency, but they benefitted the consumer in every way when it came to what you paid in the end.  You paid less with Microsoft Points in the end than you did with local currency.