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JWeinCom on 07 March 2013
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o_O.Q said:
JWeinCom said:
o_O.Q said:
JWeinCom said:
Smash's battle system is so much more coherent, fleshed out, flexible, and deep that it's kind of silly to compare them. But hey, if people legitimately like it more, than good for them. There's also people in this world who like the Spice Girls better than the Beatles. No accounting for taste.


if you prefer smash's system then fine but characters in all stars have larger movesets and actual combos so i don't see where you're going with flexibilty and depth honestly

Smash has much more freedom in mobility.  Characters can dash, have more mobility in the air, can dash attack, dash grab, dash up smash, have usable jump ins (some characters in PSASBR have these, others do not), can spot dodge, attack upon waking up, grab ledges, etc.  You have a few less moves, but that is greatly outweighed by the freedom of mobility you have.  In PSASBR your approach options are limited to a handful of dash attacks (ie Big Daddy's tackles) or walking up to your opponent and trying to smack them (for the most past, other characters have other options).   There are far more ways to approach your opponent in Smash, far more variety in how you can move, etc. 

Also keep in mind that having a large number of moves doesn't necessarily mean anything unless those moves have distinct and useful functions.  For example in Smash, ZSS has Ftilt and Dtilt, but Ftilt is rendered almost entirely obsolete because Dtilt serves the same function and is better.  In PSASBR I found little use for any of Raiden's heavy attacks, because a light attacks are faster and lead to just as much damage off a combo.  All in all, PSASBR I believe has about 4-5 more moves per character, but I found more moves to be redundant.  I have to admit though, that might be because I'm more familar with Smash than PSASBR.

As for actual combos, that's neither here nor there.  Some people like long combos, and some don't, but combos don't in any way equal depth.  Naruto Shippuuden CONR for instance is a great but rather shallow fighting games despite the fact that it has long dial a combos.  In most cases, combos are not strategy.  They're muscle memory.

Also, the usefulness of combos becomes much less in 4 player battle. 

" There are far more ways to approach your opponent in Smash, far more variety in how you can move, etc. "

i definitely don't agree take sly for example he has several abilities unique to him that can be used to approach his opponent

for example turning invisible in itself just about the best approach strategy there is imo but there's also : teleportation, teleportation behind opponent through countering, his high jump/glide etc

in fact i can't think of anyone in smash that has more apporach options than he does but i admit i could be wrong as i haven't played for a long time time

and most characters have unique abilities like those above 

 

I'm not that familiar with Sly except playing against him.  His invisibility is useful in FFA, mainly to set up his super.  In a 1v1 battle it's not too hard to keep track of him, and since he has no guard, it wasn't that useful.  I'm not familiar with his teleporting and glide.  It would depend on how much control you have over it, and the lag on it.  Zelda's teleport in smash for instant is far too slow to be considered an approach. 


It varies by extent on the character.  Raiden has a pretty good amount of approach options.  On the other hand, Big Daddy's approach options can be summed up thusly "ram into opponent" and "ram into opponent from air". The lack of a dash function is really limiting to a large part of the cast.  Cole (good) for instance is forced to rely pretty heavily on his static chain thingy at range, or his ice skating kind of attack he does on the ground.  Other than that he's pretty limited.  None of his attacks can be used for jump ins so unless he can hit you with forward square in the air, he has to come at you from the ground.  So, if you're against a character like Kratos, who has a crazy fast square attack, you really have a tough time closing in on him between attacks.

In my time with PSASBR, I've noticed many fewer strategies per character being employed.  Each character tends to have 2/3 limited methods to get close to others on average.  It might just be that people aren't good at the game right now.  Maybe we'll see some new strategies emerge later on, but the PSASBR community is very small, so that may not happen.  It's a bit hard to tell without frame data or top level play to look at how deep the game can be, but at the present it's a bit shallow.

Keep in mind that there are also large components of smash, air to air combat, legdge game, that add depth to the experience, that are deemphasized or not present in PSASBR.  Trying to prevent a character from returning the stage adds a huge amount of strategy to Smash, and dealing with certain characters in the air is another really interesting element that isn't prominent in PSASBR.