Evidence for the existence of God

[Andir]

Grey Acumen said:

godf said:
Acumen seems to have changed what he means by God proving 'beyond your ability to deny' that he exists.

At first, he indicated that this simply meant to fulfil Andir's requat for a personal audience. Which would not place any limit on Andir's free will.

He later seems to change his meaning, so that, by definition, it serves to over-ride free will. As if God intentionally overides Andir's free will, forcing him to believe, as a way of proving his existence.

That was clearly not what Andir was originally talking about.



The problem with having an all knowing, all powerful creator; and then believing that he can condemn his creation, is more interesting anyway.

When God started the big bang and sent matter spiraling through the universe, he knew it would lead to every sin you are going to commit. When he reaches down to create you soul at the point of conception, he knows whether he's creating somone he will later damn or bless.

Seems a little unfair, eh?

I never changed what I said, I simply didn't allow anyone else to change what I said.

What I was pointing out was that no matter what evidence is given, you can always deny what reality is, and come up with some other excuse for the circumstances. In order for God to prove his existenc eundeniably, he would have to do so in a manner that superceded the ability to deny, at which point free will is lost.

I'm seriously getting tired of people telling me that I'm saying something that I'm not.

 

Also, teh idea of knowing everything negating free will is also erronious. The only issue is if you think that one has to know only ONE single possible outcome. On the theory that every choice made creates an alternate path that the universe takes on the timeline, then every possible result of every possible choice could be tracked and followed.

"IF you take this action, then this will happen. IF you take this other action, something else will happen. Etc" There are an infinite number of possible choices to be made, but God is infinite and thus would be able to catalogue every result of every choice, and likely have a good feel for which choices are likely to be made as well. The choice itself is still up to thos emaking that choice though.

 

I order to prove without a doubt, all he would have had to do was do what I asked in that post.  Those were not very complicated instructions.  The timing was available, the opportunity was available.  Nothing happened at all.  That quelled my curiosity.  If something had happened at the time I wrote that, I'd start having serious doubts about my viewpoint of reality.