How to Destroy an Athiests in a argument! (Updated with poll)

[Alara317]

ninetailschris said:

Alara317 said:

DaRev said:

First off let me say that I'm sorry you feel that religion/Christianity has been basically forced down your throat for most your life - seriously, I men that.

However, such doesn't excuse your ignorance.For a serial rapist or pediafile will find very little sympathy from other for his wrong doing. I'm not calling you a rapist or a pedafile, but only pointing out that wrong doing has no excuse. I say you're doing wrong because if you know anything about religion/Christianity you would know that it is all about LOVE. And it is probably love, maybe a bit misguided, that has brought so many religious people into your life.

 Secondly, the fact that you've been in many religious discussion, doesn't mean jack. Next thing you'll be telling me is that because you have a political view, you're a Polititian or fit to be a Senator or maybe even President? Being in religious debates doesn't mean you're a religious scholar, but it could mean you've just been talking shit all these years with absolutely no foundation. Ultimately, the point I was making is that to be good at anything, you have to spend years dedicated to it, whether it be a profession, a hobby, or even Religion/christianity. Just talking about stuff doesn't make you an expert - and certainly not fit to debate Christianity.

With regards your challenge in bold, what is your argument or point of view about Christianity? For the sake of argument, mine wouuld be that God loves everyone, including you, even now. So what's your argumen or angle?

Bold - No, no it is not.  Religion is only about what an individual wants it to be about.  for some it's about controlling others through fear or desperation. for some it means justifying evils.  for some it's the unbridled truth in their eyes.  For others it's just another way to segregate us.  Since Religion as a whole has so many denominations, sub-groups, and variations (has to be up in the millions by now), there's absolutely no way you could possibly claim that you know what each and every facet of each and every variation is about.  If that's what it means to you, then by all means please do continue to preach love and tolerance and understanding and kindness, but don't dare think that just becuase you want to believe something (Religion is about Love) that it's true.  that's kind of what this whole discussion is about.  

And I'd say dedicating 7 years of my life to fighting off logical fallacies, aggressive ignorance, and constant judgement-based harassment is a pretty good amount of time dedicated to the craft of fighting religious ignorance and intolerance.  

I've had people tell me that my relationship with my girlfriend was an affront to God becuase homosexuality was a Sin.  When I asked for proof, all they were able to bring up was a quote from Leviticus where Jesus said something about it being Wicked for a man to lie with another man (citation Needed.)  I countered it saying that nowhere in there did it say that homosexuality was a sin and that it was a very vague statement up to an individual's personal judgement and interpretation.  I was once again told I was ignorant of the subject since I had the devil in me.  No refute to my point, just a casual dismissal becuase they had nothing to say.  

When people make faulty points regarding religion, science (especially evolution), and society in the name of religion, it's not hard for me to go through a list of logical fallacies and pinpoint exactly why their argument fails.  Back it up with science, back it up with history, back it up with logic and rationale and even explain the behaviours with even the most basic of human psychology, and you will not convince a religious person that they're wrong.  I quoted House earlier and I stand by my assertion that rational arguments don't work on religious people, otherwise there would be no religious people.  I'm not saying all religious people are dumb or ignorant or stupid, but the very concept of religion has about a dozen logical barriers to overcome.  The entire thing is based on faith, faith above all else that people aren't lying to you.  Faith that the bible (or whatever holy scripture you believe in) was written by the hands of god, that it was never tampered with, that the people telling you about it don't have an agenda, that something that was relevant over a millenia ago is still relevant today, that in spite of hundreds of doomsday rapture threats that never came true, that there's an afterlife.  

Every religious argument is inherently faulty becuase it's based on assertions with no backing evidence.  you can believe anything you want, and you can even debate philosophies with ease, but once you start making assertions about the genesis of the world, our place in it, and the existence of beings and their supposed judgements, you need more proof than any religion can offer.  

It can't be done, yet religion still gets to control the world.  I have a real issue with that.  And being critical of it and demanding it play by the same rules that anything else in the world has to play by is met with aggressive hostility mixed with the symphonic blubbering of zealouts unable to support their claims, collectively resorting to a base 'freedom of religion' clause.  

I really wish I had my big list of different ways to debunk religion on me.  it would be fun to copy and paste the lengthy explanations as to why each and every pro-religion argument can be effectively debated and crushed with simple logic, historical proof, and above all else, science.  

 

"Bold - No, no it is not.  Religion is only about what an individual wants it to be about."

Are we talking all religions or  just Christianity because so far this  horrible response to what he  was asking.

"Religion is only about what an individual wants it to be about.  for some it's about controlling others through fear or desperation. for some it means justifying evils.  for some it's the unbridled truth in their eyes.  For others it's just another way to segregate us.  Since Religion as a whole has so many denominations, sub-groups, and variations (has to be up in the millions by now), there's absolutely no way you could possibly claim that you know what each and every facet of each and every variation is about.  If that's what it means to you, then by all means please do continue to preach love and tolerance and understanding and kindness, but don't dare think that just becuase you want to believe something (Religion is about Love) that it's true."

Everything you said has nothing do with what bible says therefor your point is just how people react to Christianity in which case has no effort on the true value of the bible. Please tell me were it says to these people  do x from the bible because if anything I could say the same for anything. But all in all you have a problem with how people react in certain religions but not the actual religion itself in which case means your arguing from stand point personal bias not from a objective stance.

I want take a certain part from the paragraph

"If that's what it means to you, then by all means please do continue to preach love and tolerance and understanding and kindness, but don't dare think that just becuase you want to believe something (Religion is about Love) that it's true"

You gave no reason to why under christianity what he said was wrong but only just said your wrong because I personal believe your wrong. All you done so far was give subjective reactions and not attack on did the bible legitimentally said to do x. With you saying anyone can twist anything and make it true shows you have no clue what your talking about and only replying to fundamentalism with fundamentalism. If someone makes a claim about bible saying x we have data in bible and background to show what these people were saying and doing. Its called scholars and books.

"When people make faulty points regarding religion, science (especially evolution), and society in the name of religion, it's not hard for me to go through a list of logical fallacies and pinpoint exactly why their argument fails.  .  "

Why evolution? The Catholic Church accepted evolution day one. Ironic darwin was a Christian only after his child died a painful death in which case he couldn't understand why God did that to him. You say " list of logical fallacies and pinpoint exactly why their argument fails. "  but as you done so far I'm willing to bet even if you did have this list it would itself be based on fallacy and misinformation. 

"Back it up with science, back it up with history, back it up with logic and rationale and even explain the behaviours with even the most basic of human psychology, and you will not convince a religious person that they're wrong.  I quoted House earlier and I stand by my assertion that rational arguments don't work on religious people, otherwise there would be no religious people.  "

There is the cosmological argument  and  teleological argument in which uses the facts of science in deductive arguments. We can can even go into Historial case for Jesus Resurrection. If you feel like debating me in this please do so because I will show you that do back up what I say. "religious person that they're wrong" You can say the same thing about atheist which I have done before many times some which didn't have a basic ability to read. " I quoted House earlier and I stand by my assertion that rational arguments don't work on religious people, otherwise there would be no religious people. " Well I guess you can say the same for atheist :/ so I guess humans in general? Your arguments are in gerenal arguements from ignorance and nativity. You could use your examples almost exactly for atheists.

"I'm not saying all religious people are dumb or ignorant or stupid, but the very concept of religion has about a dozen logical barriers to overcome.  The entire thing is based on faith, faith above all else that people aren't lying to you.  Faith that the bible (or whatever holy scripture you believe in) was written by the hands of god, that it was never tampered with, that the people telling you about it don't have an agenda, that something that was relevant over a millenia ago is still relevant today, that in spite of hundreds of doomsday rapture threats that never came true, that there's an afterlife.  "

So, atheist don't jump over logical barriers you really want to do this? Just give me a go and I will write some down for you to read. Oh let me write down some of atheist quotes in which are so dumb it makes fundismentalist look educated. I already talked about faith and what is was described in bible as loyality based on evidence has shown by Jesus. By the way I don't have worry but someone lying to me as I actually read books on this which you haven't done mostly on anything on Christianity." that the people telling you about it don't have an agenda, that something that was relevant over a millenia ago is still relevant today". Lol here comes the conspicaries already? Why do people talk about logic then later talk bring up everyone has agenda stuff like this discredits anything you previous said and contradicts what you practice/believe. Oh again using the fallacy of time in which because x was founded in x time then x is wrong is one of the illogical arguments there is. This argument is commonly used by people who don't know history and haven't studied it and think there smart making arguments from ignorance."spite of hundreds of doomsday rapture threats that never came true, that there's an afterlife.  ""  Where are you even  getting this from? People always pre-claim doomsday Christian or atheist and were does it say any date for a the end of times why are reaching for something that isn't there? Are you just trying convince yourself with this weak arguments that you defeated the Christians? Most of your points are against non-educated Christians and generalizations.

"Every religious argument is inherently faulty becuase it's based on assertions with no backing evidence.  you can believe anything you want, and you can even debate philosophies with ease, but once you start making assertions about the genesis of the world, our place in it, and the existence of beings and their supposed judgements, you need more proof than any religion can offer.  "

What assertions you just saying this in claim format and expecting the person to just agree with it with no questions. This isn't even coherent because it doesn't tell anyone what your responding to just seems your attacking air. And are you saying science doesn't use philosophy? Do even know what your talking about at this point have you even read a book on philosophy do you even know what your addressing?

"It can't be done, yet religion still gets to control the world.  I have a real issue with that.  And being critical of it and demanding it play by the same rules that anything else in the world has to play by is met with aggressive hostility mixed with the symphonic blubbering of zealouts unable to support their claims, collectively resorting to a base 'freedom of religion' clause.  "

What did you even do to show your right besides grouping people and attacking the uneducated/ easy targets? You haven't made on logical point and have to say to far it's been all incoherent and dodging the issue.

"I really wish I had my big list of different ways to debunk religion on me.  it would be fun to copy and paste the lengthy explanations as to why each and every pro-religion argument can be effectively debated and crushed with simple logic, historical proof, and above all else, science.  "

Ok I'm here bring it on crush my arguments with your "logic" and I hope you come with the good ones because far it's been pretty weak. Actually weak would be a understatement.

I seriously wouldn't be surprised if you just copy and paste some random site or use wiki in which someone else did and was shown quickly how that will not fly. So,please why not destroy the arguments that I mention and please stop attacking easy targets because of your lack of ability to take on the actually issues.

 

Wow.  All I can say is wow.  In an effort to give you the respect I thought you deserved, I thought to myself, "You know, these people seem pretty keen on getting me to whip out my debate chops; maybe I'll try a point for point rebuttal."  

then I started reading your response and I think I lost a few IQ points.  

I only made it about 1/3 through your post before giving up trying to understand the point you were trying to make.  I copied and pasted your responses to friends and even 4chan to see if anyone could make the slightest sense out of what you were trying to say, and the most common response I got was to - you know what, in the interest of being nice I'll clean up the language a bit - ask if you were either very young or suffering a severe concussion.  

Not only do you not know how to spell, but you can't write a proper sentence to save your life and your ability to convey ideas and points is so broken that trying to interpret your rambling jibberish is like decoding subtitles on a foreign porno when I was 12, and the signal was jammed and you could barely make out a tit. 

I'm well aware that this is technically an ad hominem attack, and that doesn't make me look mature or able to debate your points, but when I have to spend 3x as long deciphering what it is you're trying to say as I would take planning and writing a rebuttal, I'm only further reminded why I don't bother arguing with people about religion.  I've debated with intelligent, well-spoken people before, but your post is a rather scathing commentary on the group as a whole.  Go back, rewrite that at a 5th grade level, and I'd love to have a discussion with you.  Until then, please go read a book or something.  In fact, this is a game forum, may I recommend a game?  I heard Mavis Beacon teaches typing is a great starter; and as an added bonus it's on for 20% off! 

http://www.broderbund.com/c-28-typing-keyboarding.aspx?gclid=CPO-wfSOmbQCFY9DMgod6T4AIg

Now, I'm going to return to trying to interpret your incoherent rant to see if I can salvage something from it.  I'll get back to you soon.