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@ SuperDave Well I was refering to something on a larger scale, and hope and guidance is offered first and foremost by society, and a secular one at that, the curch did none of that in the middle ages, rather it was pure fear and opression. as to your second post, I had an answer to that in another thread ,the bottom line was that despite religion being used for so much evil, it is still viewed as pure, incoruptable and unquestionable, and that is just wrong.