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cleveland124 on 08 February 2008
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TheRealMafoo said:
cleveland124 said:

I didn't infer that only religous individuals have morals.  My point was if you don't start with a religion how can you say anyone is wrong in their beliefs?  Assume no God.  I go kill person B because I wanted something of his.  How can you say this is wrong?  If you impose some sort of group theory you could argue that said individual is valuable to the group and thus I shouldn't have killed him.  But what if he wasn't valuable to the group.  Then maybe it was good that I killed him.  Either way, without religion individuals are only held responsible to themselves, not the group.


 Almost every animal in the wild only kills for food. They don't kill for fun (ironically, that's just humans, and a very select number of animals).

So why don't animals just go kill for the hell of it? They never had a god tell them it's wrong.

I have never believed in god, but I would never kill anyone. I would realize how my family would feel if it was done to me, and realize that there families would feel the same way with him gone. I would not want to be responsible for the misfortune on anyone. 

Humanity teaches me this. Not religion. There are many other reasons not too kill another man. Are you telling me that in your view of the world that the only reason you don't do so is because God would be mad at you?

I hope that's not the only reason you don't kill people 


Almost every group of animals kill for fun.  My dog kills things and carries the animals around like trophies.  My cat kills mice and when they are bored of them they move on.  Animals are extremely territorial and if you simply step on "their" land, if they had the ability they would kill you (see bear, wildcat). 

So you wouldn't kill anyone because of your family.  What if someone killed all of your family (and thus you wouldn't have any one to dissapoint).  And surprise he is caught.  And the judge says I sentence him to life in prison or I'll let you (being the victim) kill him as a retribution.  Do you kill him?  What is your reasoning now?  Further he doesn't have any family and friends so nobody is going to miss him.  Is it now so immoral to kill?

Your parents taught you morals, thus you don't kill.  Humanity has taught us to kill.  As early as the wild west people would have have public executions.  People sat up lawn chairs and watched the civil war.  Humanity is far more violent than you think.   

I'm too religious to envisioning killing a man.  But using your example, if I never experienced the close love of a family, a friend, or a lover, would it then be so wrong if I went around killing individuals?  Can you hold me responsible because I don't have the same background as you.  Most people that commit murders today never had a strong family.  Had to support themselves on the street, can't afford their family and steal to try to make ends meet.  If you eliminated these murders you'd be left with only a few psychopaths that actually like to kill.