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IIIIITHE1IIIII said:
MrBubbles said:
"but the punishment ought to be on the rapist and not attacking the child.”

i agree with this position, in theory...but i really cant argue for it. the rape itself would be a great trauma for them to deal with, so i dont know how many women could deal with carrying the child even if its just going to be put up for adoption.


It's the way he is saying it. I would never refer to a fetus as a child, just like I wouldn't with a newly fertilized egg.

 

If only there was a way of measuring when they become self-conscious. In my opinion that's when abortion should not be acceptable anymore.

That would be at birth at the earliest.
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=when-does-consciousness-arise
No conciousness without experience, the fetus spends most of his time in a dreamless sleep state.

However having 2 kids actual conciousness / self awareness comes much later.
I think they suck it out of you during the first few months that you spend in severe sleep deprivation mode, them little vampires :) I still can't think straight after the 2nd one!