Shooting at Batman Premiere - 12 dead / Your opinions on gun laws

[Mr Khan]

insomniac17 said:

Mr Khan said:

And with which people could be non-lethally armed to stop him.

This is where the argument breaks down. In a world without guns, we would still have many weapons to stop crime: useful, nonlethal weapons, and thus avoid senseless wasting of life.

That organized crime can acquire weapons abroad is inevitable, but that is an invalid argument for justifying everyone owning weapons.

Sure. They could be. But there are plenty of crimes that still happen without any guns being involved.

The argument doesn't break down though. You're saying that despite the most dangerous criminals being able to obtain guns, that doesn't justify allowing law abiding citizens to have guns. How is that so? For what reason do you justify prohibiting law abiding citizens from owning guns, knowing full well that there are criminals out there who have them? You are limiting the ability of a person to protect themselves.

I'm guessing that you're thinking, it's probably not likely that you'll ever encounter a mafia member with a gun, so there's really no reason for you to have one. But what if I did? Then I'm out a gun, and I'm completely at their mercy. When I argue for allowing people to have guns, I don't expect the vast majority to need to use them. But I would rather have one if I needed it, than not have one just because you don't think that it's necessary.

Here is my problem. By restricting gun ownership, you are removing somewhat easier access for criminals. You are also prohibiting the vast majority of people who would not commit a crime from owning one. Worse yet, you are removing their ability to protect themselves from criminals that you acknowledge will still have access to guns. You are ensuring that only criminals own guns. I do not understand why that is a good idea.

In a world without guns, lots of things could happen. But we do have guns in the world. I fail to see how prohibiting the people least likely to commit a crime from owning guns is in any way a good idea.

What ifs tend to be rather slippery. Organized crime tends to be fairly benign about gun violence, unless they're waging a war of their own like in Mexico currently, their victims tend to be one another, or police or such. It's not like street gangs, who would be less able on the matters of acquisition, but more likely to use the guns in petty disputes. While it would not be perfect, I would say it would be preferable to the status quo.