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Metallicube on 21 January 2008
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elprincipe said:
Metallicube said:
 

*rolls eyes, yes I'm implying that we just make robberies legal as well.. Come on, that is a different arguement entirely and you know it.. Abortion is not a "crime" no matter how you want to spin it.. it is a legal and legit procedure that is offered for situations that call for it. Like some people mentioned here, pro-lifers get tied up in their "moral" values and let it interfere with logic.

Making abortion illegal would just make matters worse because there would be no legal, well trained doctors performing the procedures and women would resort to unpleasent and far more dangerous methods by underground organizations that probably wouldn't be nearly as well trained to keep the procedure clean and safe. Would you really want this to happen? Because the way I see it, making abortions illegal would simply hurt the cause of you pro-lifers. We would be doing far more harm than good by making abortions illegal nationwide. And even the women that would shy away from underground methods would simply travel to another country to get it done. No matter how hard the pro lifers try, abortion is never going to go away, so we need to keep it legal, and therefore safe, clean, and highly regulated.

Like I said, I am not "pro abortion." I don't see abortion as a good thing by any means, only as something that may be a necessity. The important thing is that the woman has the choice of whether or not to do the moral thing, and I trust most women would, (and if they wouldn't, I'm sure they have a damn good reason). I'm not for killing babies and I'm sure nobody who's pro choice is.. I think that abortion should be used ONLY as a last resort, (mainly rape, or if the life of the child/ mother is threatened). The morallity of this issue should be looked at by the individual scenarios, not abortion as a whole. Pro-lifers see this as a black and white issue when it's not the case. The Government should never have the right to gain the power to have the say over what happens with a woman's body. End of story. For me, this is more of an anti-government intervention issue more than abortion issue.


I agree abortion is not a crime under the law at this point in time.  Of course that's a fact.  It certainly doesn't make it right.  But the argument is the same.  You are saying we shouldn't outlaw something because people still do it.  Well, people still rape women and commit armed robbery despite them being illegal, yet I don't hear anyone arguing we legalize those things...so why is that a logical thing to say with regard to abortion?  And it's not really a "legit" procedure in terms of health since the American Medical Association says it's, and I quote, "never medically necessary."

Because half the country does not see abortion as a crime, whereas 99.9% of the country believes that robbery is wrong and is a crime. Don't you find it the slightest bit odd that half the country would support this form of "murder" as you call it?

You also have the strange opinion that making abortion illegal wouldn't lower the amount of abortions taking place.  That is a just plain crazy position.  Go check how many abortions were performed in states where abortion was illegal prior to January 22, 1973 compared to today and tell me the numbers wouldn't decrease from 1.2 million babies killed in a single year.  Of course they would decrease.  Would some do it illegally?  Absolutely.  Would some travel to Canada or Europe and have abortions performed?  Of course.  Does that mean we should allow babies to be killed since, after all, they might be killed somewhere else?  Of course not.

Nowhere did I make the claim that making abortion illegal would increase the amount of abortions (although I really don't think it would decrease as much as you think. A woman who would go through such a dramatic procedure such as abortion would probably go through severe lengths if the situation was dire enough). What it WILL do is make the system more chaotic, more gruesome, more unhealthy for the woman, and far less civilized. 

Your last paragraph is quite puzzling.  You seem to accept that abortion is killing babies, yet you say that the government shouldn't have a say over what happens with a woman's body.  These two ideas are incompatible.  If you accept that the fetus is a human baby, it isn't part of another human being, and therefore the government has every right (and responsibility) to protect the life of one human from being killed by another.  Basically, if abortion = murder, then it logically follows that the government should make it illegal as it has for all other murders.

I guess I misspoke on this part. If you want my honest opinion, no I do not believe that a fetus is a true "human being" yet since it is part of the mother and depends on her for life. So I should not have said "baby" because in my view a fetus becomes a human "baby" once it is born and it independant from the mother for support. So no, I do not believe abortion is murder. I understand you do, and I respect that. But this is where we should agree to disagree because neither of us will change eachother's minds on this matter. At the end of the day it boils down to the individual's perspective of morallity and this perspective will never change in a person's mind.