High School Gay Bashing Caught on Video. Bully Got Off with a 3 Day Suspension.

[sapphi_snake]

kain_kusanagi said:

sapphi_snake said:

kain_kusanagi said:

sapphi_snake said:

kain_kusanagi said:
All bulling are "hate crimes". I'm glad the mother is pressing charges and I hope the bully goes to juvi. But I can't stand the term "hate crime". Everyone who perpetrates violence is motivated by hate of some kind, so why do we segregate certain crimes as worse then others. If a bully beats up a nerd and gets a 3 day suspension it wouldn't make the news, but if the nerd was gay it is suddenly worse? That's what I don't understand. We should treat punish bullies harshly no matter who or why they beat them up. Their motive should only be used as evidence to convict them, not decide a sentence.

This is actually not true. There are several reasons why people can commit violent crimes. For example desperation (e.g. robbing someone because you need money), or even love (e.g. crimes of passion). And I'm not sure if you know anything about the legal system, but motive is mandatory when deciding how to sentence someone. This is the case with basically every crime. This is the difference between 1st degree and 2nd degree murder for example. And it's the best way to decide how dangerous a criminal is.

The prosecution uses motive to define the culpability of the defendant. The motive is a kind of evidence in convicting the defendant. Once you have a conviction the motive is irrelevant. Some crimes have minimum sentences. Take Murder 1 for example. The motive was used to convict, but the sentence is determined by the crime.

As for the reasons for violent crimes. I am very much aware there are many motives for committing violence. I was obviously talking about bullies not robbers.

My point was always that hate for a nerd or a gay or a minority are equal. Hate for someone who bumped your shoulder is just as irrational as gay bashing. I don't like the term "hate crime" becuase is segregates and we need less segregation and more equality in this world.

Nope, it's not. The motive is used to decide what charges you're bringing against someone. And whether a crime is murder 1, or murder 2 or something else is determined by the motive.

And no, hate for someone who bumped your shoulder isn't the same as hating a minority. It's actually more rational than hating a minority (mainly because you're hating a single individual who actualy did something to you - albeit by accident - as opposed to an entire group of people, where you don't know any of the individuals, and simply hate them due to a trait they share that is neutral and not harmful).

Conviction and sentencing are two different proceedings. Motive is used to prove culpability, to define the crime, (murder 1, 2, etc.(, and to get a conviction. Once the court has a conviction it schedules a sentencing hearing. At the hearing either a judge or jury decides a fitting punishment based on the crime defined in the previous conviction. If it's murder 1 then there is usually a minim sentence unaffected by pc terms like "hate crime".

And no, hating a group for a shared trait is not worse than hating someone who did something minor to you. Neither is more rational than the other. Nobody has the right to do harm to another person unprovoked. Why should we punish some who beat up a gay person more than someone who beat up a Cardinals fan or a Playstation fanboy, or a PETA member, or a democrat/republican, or a Occupy Wall Street protester/Tea Party member? The fact is people hate all kinds of people, but the law states that if you hate a non-white or a homosexual than your hate is worse. that's just stupid. Use the motive to convict, but we don't need a law on the books that separates groups of people and defines them by how others hate them.

Ummm, if a crime was deemed a hate crime, then the sentence is increased. You're suppose to give a sentence depending on the type of crime it was determined to be.

And in your example (guy bumping into you) you can consider that the attacker was provoked. And it's people part of the majority group (white heterosexuals) who are most dangerous, while minorities are most likely to be victims of hate crimes.