Poll: Israel or Palestine?

[Joelcool7]

esssam said:

The thing is, you may name them terrorists but what these people want is their land which was taken from them in the first place..... Israel is basically a group of people who forcefully entered a country, killed its people and used its land to create its own nation. What the palestinians want are their rights. Israel has all the weaponry and such while palestinians' only weapons are the use of suicide bombers (thus they are automatically classified as terrorists). If a palestinian killed an israeli, israel kills 50 people in return (including women & children) and the cycle goes on, if you look at the amount of dead people on both sides dead palestinians are about 10 times (or more) as much as the dead israelis.. As an example, in the gaza war from december 2008 to january 2009 israeli casualties were 13 compared to 1417 dead palestinians.. Im sorry but now you cant call the palestinians 'Terrorists', in fact it IS the opposite way around but the american and israeli media are being completely biased. What about the freedom flotilla? You think this was israelis acting in "self defence??"!

Honestly, no matter how much you argue, there cant be any other reason for why palestinians are angry from israelis, and you definitely cant just blindly call it 'Terrorism' which simply happens without reason because everything has a reason...

In the end, the palestinians are the ones who rightfully own the land now named 'Israel' which is why the palestinians will never give up.... Israel have always been calling for peace? fine, palestine went to the UN to get recognised as a different state to achieve peace but NO USA has to intervene somehow and veto everything in sight so that israel can stay in control and freeze their development. Even though Obama himself had said a year ago that palestinians should have their own recognised state.. but why did he contradict himself then? because jews control the american economy and Obama obviously wants to get reelected. 

 

Umm yah you see Jews always resided in Israel it was their land originally and always has been. The Islamic armies and such took over for periods of time but the land has always been rightfully the Jews. However your argument doesn't hold up for other reasons as well. Firstly Palestinians and Muslims have been able to immigrate to Israel and Muslims make up such a huge part of the population you can't possibly argue that Israel isn't their state as well. Another reason against your argument since when in wars have the natives deserved their land in full or it is considered a humanitarian crime? I can't recall any empire ever saying to the people "You know we conquered your land for reasons and now we feel bad so we are returning it to you and pulling all our people out". That has never happened to my knowledge. Look at Canada, USA and Australia we all occupy land originally occupied by natives. Our countries have realized we did them wrong and given them land but we aren't about to give the whole country back pack up and leave.

Fact is Israel didn't take all of Palestine they didn't even take the whole country as defined by the Romans which deemed it Jewish land. The Israeli Government has been fairly understanding, they have the military capabilities to take all of Palestine. Sure there would be public out cry and another huge war but Israel is more then capable of taking it all if they wanted.

As for terrorists. Yes some Israeli soldiers commit acts of terror but a lot of the casualties are results of shelling and such not directly targeting civilians they most often get caught in the cross fire. Also you mention the Israeli response always being ten times that of Palestine well no shit Israel isn't going to send a strong message by only responding with the exact same amount of violence. Say 30 rockets are fired into Israel and only kill one civilian does that mean that Israel should only kill a single Palestinian? No they need to take out those rocket launchers. Which by the way are often in residential areas or highly populated facilities. I've heard of rocket launchers at schools. Now what is the Israeli Government supposed to do? Just sit back and let the rockets fly because the cowardly Palestinians are firing from populated areas? Or respond taking out targets with as few casualties as possible. Fact is its the fault of the Palestinian authority and Hamas that so many people die. Also the fact that these terrorists have no allegiance they don't listen to one another they have no problem attacking their own people and rule with fear. That makes them terrorists.

As for the flotilla. Israel probably shouldn't have boarded the ship at all. They should have physically escorted it to an Israeli port and then searched the vessel with enough military and police support to avoid casualties. However the flotilla was not a peace flotilla as you describe the members had criminal intent and the intent to murder Israeli troops. Prior to Israel boarding they had stocked up weapons to fight. Once Israel boarded them they took those weapons and attacked the Israeli troops. Some would argue that its self defense but if for example "I know there is a group of KKK members meeting and I grab a couple guns and go into their meeting place yelling black power and provoke them. When they respond I pull a gun and blow their brains all over the floor was it their fault? Sadly absolutely not I knew I was going to get attacked and went into the situation hoping to kill some. That is murder" Each and every person on that flotilla attempted murder that day and if the Israeli troops who boarded hadn't fired their weapons they would have been murdered. The Israeli navy on the other hand sent those troops in armed with paint ball guns they never intended to kill or harm anyone on board. Those men are just lucky they had their side arms or they would all be dead. Also Israel planned to let all of the vital aid into Gaza anyways and had no intentions of arresting and sending flotilla members to prison. So I can't possibly see the flotilla in any other way then full support of Israel.

Umm yah Obama didn't contradict himself at all. If you read my initial response you will clearly see his position. Obama like almost every other western country wants to see Palestine recognized. They all want the two state solution, but the way Palestine went about getting recognized is border line illegal. It is low and circumvents diplomacy its a move meant to blackmail Israel and manipulate the global community into giving Palestine everything they want without any compromises to Israel or negotiations.

Then Israel running the American economy lol thats a joke. Canada is the largest contributing nation to the US economy and guess what Obama violated our trade agreements and actually betrayed our Government. He has no problem in damaging relations with the countries that hold America up. Yah he wants to be re-elected but his position on Israel isn't likely effected by that very much.