| Sri Lumpa said: |
"So not believing is evil? So you are telling me that hindus, muslims, buddhists... and possibly other christian denominations are evil for not believing?"
I only mentioned evil but i could have said God does not allow anything besides what He is, within Him - and that also implies evil, corruption, desbelief, etc.
"Then why do you insist on applying a looser standard to god?"
It`s not a looser standard and it`s not even special pleading as God does not need both. All i´m trying to show is that seeing the world only from morality and (only) actions gives you a partial/incomplete view of God.
Killing is immoral but in self-defense or in defense of others is not. Even for human justice things can be seen in a different light. Call it preservation of human life, with God is like preservation of grace and purity/calling for judgment.
"everybody starts at the same standard"
WE start at the same standard or same common ground, not God. God is not human to be put in the same level.
"And pushing someone in front of a car also put them in the face of a choice and that's it too, no difference"
Thing is, independently of where you stand in your life, everytime life presents you with a choice, whatever the way of that happening, you choose based on two outcomes. Before this choice is actively made/followed you did not move an inch from where you were. If you go left or right it`s because you went left or right, not because someone told you about left or right. It`s not how things happen. If only you choose your path, then a choice cannot do it for you. And that`s the illusion: you only attribute faith the pushing in front of a car, but not every single choice people go trough in their lives, because with faith it seems different than everything else.
""And in Lord Jesus Christ, [...], begotten of the Father before all worlds, [...], begotten, not made...""
Yes it is true. The problem is people can`t guess. God revealed Himself to humanity and in the same way, prophets revealed the coming of Christ. remember how John the Baptist welcomed Christ.
Jesus always existed but only from a certain period of time, was His existance revealed.
"By opening your heart you are already displaying belief in god"
As much as it seems like that, it`s not exactly like that. When people open themselves it`s more in the sense of giving it a chance - as vague as this expression may seem.
To some it may mean putting their fears away first. Doesn`t necessarily mean faith because there is no true love, trust and belief.
"And when was that sign made public?"
The sign in the sky told by Mary, an "unknown light", as the beggining of a new war, was what Lucia understood as being the aurora in the night of Januray 25th 1938. Two monts before Hitler started his conquests.
The term break-out, i don`t find it fitting. In portuguese is written by Lucia as "começará" which means "will start".
And in fact it did. The birth of WW2 was there. Had not Hitler started his conquests and there would not be a WW2.
I can`t find explicit references to this action or others, i can only find references to a letter in 1929 where it`s described the request for the reparation. Which the Church only made it public in 1939, so i correct myself in saying it did so too late! Thank you.
But Mary did spoke about those who believed: the martyrs.
"It wouldn't make sense for god (either directly or in the form of Jesus or through Mary) to instruct Lucia to reveal"
No one understands God to be able to really explain it. Ony God really knows why exactly it chose Lucia, Jacinta and Francisco for receiving the message.
The consecration was for Russia, not for the world, and so, peace would only come after that. But only for a period of time.
And if you look back, the world was at peace after that, not complete peace because humanity won`t go away. Before the consecration you had the spread of communism with it`s hatred for religion, the cold war.
It all ended and Russia did convert by embracing religion once again, and with that, God.
As far as i know, the letter Lucia wrote predated 1960, it seems that it was she who asked for it to be opened at this date because she believed the world would better understand it at this time (the part of the secret about Russia).
"those who don`t forgive and hate bind themselves to a life without peace and hate."
Those who don`t forgive and hate is not the same person.
An actions always gets a reaction. If you don`t forgive, hate, not trust, etc., won`t live in harmony withing your self and with God. God`s punishment is also the same as saying: "So, you don`t want ME, so i`ll leave in your own troubles".
Different meanings doesn`t mean you can`t find the true one. If somebody does something against, why did this happen? It`s never random, so you got to read into it because sometime it actually has more than one interpretation.
When your father punished you it´s not only because of the action, but also because of the reason behind it.
"The passage talks about false prophets"
It is about prophets but not only. It`s showing how one can discover how someone is good by not just looking at what they say, but also at what they do. You can say you love God but if your heart and actions show something else, you know that that love isn´t honest. And actually the same applies at faith.
About false prophets and false Christs: "Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3 but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus, that spirit is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world"
And Matthew 24-25: "For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible. 25See, I have told you ahead of time"
Acts of the Apostles: Acts 13 4-12
"but your belief definitely lowers its importance with respect to faith"
It honestly doesn`t. You can`t just honor Jesus with your lips, your heart needs to do the same. The love for Jesus needs, absolutely, to be within as outside of you.
"but when you look at the old testament it is bad fruit after bad fruit (mass murders, wars, genocides...) and thus according to the standard given by Jesus o recognise bad trees the old testament is such a bad tree"
Depends on how you read God and prophets.
It`s the same as those who claim to love God, but they do it only with their lips, not their hearts and gestures. They speak one thing and show another.
With God, you always read and see the same thing. But you need to know how to read Him because he`s not human and He is the basis of everything good.
For example, it`s not because God punishes that He is less good. Our goodness comes from God, but it doesn`t mean it`s to be seen the same. Being goodness and experiencing it in a human form is really different.
"But when you get to know the girl and get to see that she is a good person you can get to love her even if you didn't believe in her existence before meeting her."
But the fact is, all this happens during your lifetime. Not after. And it is in this life that everything is decided.
"If christianity was a true religion it would not need to rely on faith but on truth only"
Isn`t Jesus the truth, path, life? Faith is also love for the truth.
"seek the truth and you will find me" or in other words, open yourself to God - ask for the living water - and you shall receive it. Love and you shall receive God. That is the truth of life.
"They have no remorse and thus can't repent. Do you know what happens to people who do not repent?"
Do you think God is blind to that? God is fair.
"When people follow hate and silence the pain of others or morality, they "decided" to follow a path"
I was speaking only from a point of view.
When you follow hate in every action despite seeing the bad consequences, you do silence something.
"But they might shut it off and refuse to use it"
You see, it`s not really a question of religion. It`s seeing how people love their lives. Some do repent what they do, others don`t, but then again, in this case, they longer follow hate.
