Islam is not bad, too many of you are ignorant of history.

[Joelcool7]

superchunk said:

Joelcool7 said:

 

Hey Super Chunk I have a question that I have been to afraid to ask my Muslim friend. He's always trying to convert me so I try to change the subject as much as possible and not discuss Islam or Christianity.

But he says that the Bible is a Holy Text in Islam and that Jesus is a prophet of Allah. However he says Jesus never died on the cross or resurected three days later. He says Jesus ascended like Muhammed.

But this gets me confused.

The Bible clearly states that Jesus is the son of God. It also says in the Bible that Jesus died and was resurected. Jesus himself claimed to be the son of God. So this has had me puzzled wouldn't Jesus have been a false prophet as he claimed to be Gods son? And how can the Bible be a Holy Text when it clearly says Jesus resurected three days after being killed on the cross?

The only thing I agree with his mythology is that Jesus ascended to heaven and is coming back. But he ascended after being killed on the cross.

My Muslim friend gets highly pissed off at me. One time he came into my house and my Bible was on the ground. He started yelling at me, The Bible is a Holy Book it should not be on the ground how can you treat it like that.

But if the Bible is such a Holy Book and Jesus is truly a prophet of Allah then why don't Muslim's read the Bible? And how can the Bible be a holy text since it clearly states Jesus is God's son. And how can Jesus be a prophet when he said he was God's son. And how can Jesus not die on the cross in Islam while dying on the cross in the "Holy" Bible?

It's just something I've always wanted to ask him but never had the balls too!

According to the Qur'an...

Jesus is a Prophet just any before him and Muhammad after. He was human not a god in any form. The Qur'an states that Jesus has not died, that it only appeared to others as if he was on the cross. Instead he was pulled up to God until it is time for him to return to be the Messiah. His job was to return the Jews back to God's path, using miracles to prove his message is true, and then leave in order to return later to bring the end of the worlds.

The Qur'an also teaches that it is not the first holy writing to be given to people. The Jews received their Torah from Prophet Moses, however over the centuries they have lost parts of its meanings and have always received other prophets to bring them back on track (of which Jesus was the last).

The Qur'an also says Jesus brought a purely verbal "book" called the Ingil. This book is not the New Testament. However, parts of it can be found in the NT through Jesus' teachings and parables.

According to history and the Bible itself...

Jesus never claimed to be a literal "son of god" or an actual god himself. It was common during that time for people to proclaim how good they are at something. As an example, someone who is a great blacksmith would have said they are the "son of a blacksmith". Whether they really were or not was irrelevant. Additionally, hit up one of the many search able online Bible's and you can find that all throughout the OT prophets, random people, animals, trees, etc are all at times referred to as son(s), daughter(s), children of God. It is simply a phrase to get a meaning across that this person is a great worshiper of God. This can be seen in the bible where Jesus actually shows the opposite of him being god by:

John 20:17 "Jesus told her, "Don't hold on to me, because I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and tell them, 'I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.' "

Statements like this are all through the Bible. Jesus was clearly always aware of his role and his separation from the God he worshiped.

Additionally, a little study of early Christianity also proves that the entire idea of Trinity/Jesus as a god was really just a result of Roman forced acceptance of Christianity and especially the outcome of the vote put forth during the Council of Nicaea in 325CE.... 300 years after Jesus left. At this time there was a major divide among Christians regarding Jesus' divinity and some believed as most do today that Jesus was part of God in a holy trinity, while many others, as they still do today in Egypt,Ethiopia,parts of Lebanon... that Jesus was a Prophet and not God. The Roman leaders wanted to keep it from going into a civil war and began the first of the many religious councils where entire parts of the belief system were put to a vote. The first was whether or not Jesus was divine and the Trinity group was better represented and won. So basically, you can consider most of all modern beliefs in Christianity based on popular votes.

Same goes with the specific collection of books/letters that now exist in the Bible. The specific dates for Easter and Christmas, etc. All based on Romans (who only accepted Christianity to keep off from a larger war and division) diplomatic skills to get all the pagans to accept a forced conversion to Christianity.

 

However, yes a real Muslim would regard ALL the holy books and Prophets as equals as the Qur'an specifies as such. I have multiple TaNahKs, Bibles, and Qur'ans in my house. They are all well respected and have their specific spots. My children know not to mishandle any of them and respect the beliefs of each and their followers. Because in the end....

Chapter 5 - 69
"Surely those who believe and those who are Jews and the Sabians and the Christians whoever believes in Allah (The God) and the last day and does good-- they shall have no fear nor shall they grieve. "

Man you need to re-read the Bible if you have ever done so. John 14:6 "Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." Throughout the Bible Jesus makes many claims to be the direct son of God. I have read the Bible cover to cover three times and while yes I don't have it all memorized I am very sure the Trinity and Jesus claiming to be God are both cornerstones in the Bible's make up.

As for what the Roman's did. They never changed the Bible itself, the Catholic's have the Dogma and other Holy Books. But the Bible itself was not altered. Christmas and Eastern were made so that Christian's could celebrate pagan holiday's without being pagan themselves. However note that the Bible was not altered to tell you the specific days of Easter or Christmas. These days were chosen by the Romans.

But I can rest assure you that the Bible was not altered by the romans. I know this because the dead sea scrolls (Basis for the Bible) actually came to a University in my area and translators translated them again. The origional documents exist today and are constantly being translated. Also almost all translations come out nearly identical.

The Roman's may have created holiday's and shaped the way Christian's thought but the Bible itself and its teachings remained un-altered.

Also just so we are clear, we do both believe in the same God. The God of Abraham the only difference is I believe Jesus was the messiah and the third part of the Holy Trinity. While you believe he was a prophet but you to believe he is the mesiah.

Also the Holy Trinity

Isaiah 48:16 “I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; From the time that it was, there am I; and now the Lord God, and his Spirit, hath sent me.”

Mathew 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the father, and of the son and of the Holy Ghost.

Just to point out two of the passages in the Bible which confirm the Trinity.