Can Egyptians do it?

[dib8rman]

elticker said:

dib8rman said:

=/ I really can't see why anyone would want Mubarak out of power.

If the people's party wins it wil be an Islamic Nationalism or a Islamic "democratic" autocracy.

The people of Egypt just aren't ready for a Democracy at all, it's just another Arabian in struggle only this time they can't blame the US... nevermind.

A brief history on Mubarak though: Mubarak is a Egyptian nationalist, and used to be a very lax guy until his boss was killed in front of him by members of the Islamic Brotherhood. Since then he only helped Egypt on a secular path in the same way his boss did. At some point though his issues became Egypts issues and thus the Mubarak we have today. He litterally see's the welfare of Egypt as his own. If anyone here follows his interviews you would know he's stubborn as hell so he has the make shift parts of a dictator.

Egypts economical issues were not his fault either, the place is filled with very ignorant folk who... first off Egypt is heavily bent on it's agricultural sector  and so it doesn't help when you kill off your live stock at a whim of some virus, especially when you've just gone through 3 famines.

What I think is Mubaraks fault though is his issue with pigs. =/ If it weren't for his idiotic decision with the pigs Cairo would be a nice place to live still... live poor but still live.

we have suez canal, tourism, gas, oil so no it was his issue we are now in debt of 880 billion us dollars. when he first came to power it was only 12 billion. live poor what you don't know how hard it is to live in egypt some people work 3 jobs and can barely find money for bread to survive thats not his fualt. graduates of all faculties can't find jobs so this isn't his fualt nothing is right. he give gas to israel for shit prices, almost for free when he sells it to his own poeple for full price that isn't his fualt. 30 years is a heck of a longtime to make economic reforms, what he did in it was increase egyptains debt by 868 billion dolars that nothing dam i get that in one day of work. Please you don't live in egypt so don't speack about life in egypt. All he did all these years was working for the good of israel, US rather than the good of his people. heck he stole 70 billion dollars from us and his associates stole just as much if not more.  

I see so it's all Israels fault, I am fully aware of the other sections of revenue for Egypt but agriculture has always been the leading sector, I did indicate as much in the post you quoted.
 My point was that so long as god comes first in politics there is no room for democracy. The ideology of a democracy is that the people come before god and individually you may hold whatever deity you wish over yourself.
For the record Egypt has been part of the Opec standardized oil price reg for as long as I can remember, they have the same price to Israel as they do to the US adding only shipping to the price. I believe the prices in 08 was by Opec set at around $85 - $100 a barrel. Israel from what I gather paid in the same time frame around $70 - $80's a barrel, which makes total sense geographically.
In other words your story isn't adding up with the numbers. Do your own research.
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It's not about just getting a higher level of education, and what do I know about working hard? Seriously if I was a jerk I'd point out that it's always been for 22 years the peoples of Egypt’s responsibility to remove your president in a popular movement it's not the job of any outside nation to violate any other nations sovereignty just to install a democracy. In the word's of James Madison "Eternal vigilance by the people is the price of liberty."
As for how hard I work, that's honestly none of your business.
As for your economy, Egypt actually had a surplus in 05 which was the height of the "Recession" (Clearly not for Egypt). Mubarak is credited for boosting foreign investment and paving a road for Egypt to get out of the red. Since 1990 the winds have been in the Egyptian sails.

What it comes down to are those pigs,  if he never culled them Egypt would probably have been the 2nd or 1st Arab nation to join the EU.

You have to understand that my only issue with removing Mubarak is that the people will be unaware of their geopolitical situation and though they have the best intention for Egypt (I hope) they will do it in the name of Allah. I’ve seen idiots chanting in Egypt for the return of a Caliphate by overthrowing all the dictators, if this position is popular in the heart of Arabs then world war three is a guarantee. Dramatic I suppose but men of god have proven themselves to be the most dangerous men on earth.

As for the 880 billion dollar loss, ask yourself where those people got the money to get their higher education, what about the medicine that is imported for the most populated Arab country; ask who paid for that? Don’t “let’s forget that.” These were social interests for a grand part that caused the deficit. Though Egyptian universities are among the worst in the world the government has been sinking money into them to make them into the best they can be. 

I’m not saying there hasn’t been corruption though, I’m positive their has been, it’s just Cold War guys like Mubarak are super patriots and take Egyptian matters personally. It’s part of why he could be trusted.

In the indelible words of Jack Sparrow “You can always trust a liar to tell you a lie, it’s the truthful ones you’ve got to be careful of.”

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In the end though your the one living in it and your the ones who fought him out, dude I just hope I'm wrong and you guys can form a democracy with enlightened values.

So hats off to you and best wishes with whatever you guys do over there.