Kinect: DaVinchi App. (WoW)

[Shadowblind]

theprof00 said:

Shadowblind said:

Bolded line completely annihilated your argument. Microsoft employees manipulating Kinect in their spare time on the PC is not prohibited by Microsoft, nor does it have anything to do with the loss of revenue as it has not led to any illegal activity such as pirating commercial titles.

While I don't know near anything about the technical side of Kinect or coding beyond very basic terms, I used to live and breath the homebrew PSP scene for years. I'm well aware of what is legal and illegal in terms of creating applications using a company's product; this isn't illegal. Microsoft also stated that they made Kinect very easy to manipulate and create drivers for on a PC so people could use use it on Windows 7, and have specifically stated that they have not changed the code of the device. Now, if these "Microsoft" hackers were creating ways to play Kinect games without paying for them, thats illegal. I may have missed it if they have; need link if true. Will validate your argument, and invalidate mine.

Now if Microsoft paid it's employees to make apps for Kinect under an online psuedonym, thats a different argument, and also one that isn't illegal or negative in nearly any stretch of the imagination. If Microsoft wants to show the capabilities of it's new device on a person-to-person level, doing this would be a good way to do so. It would also be a help to indie devs looking to utilise Kinect on 360.

Alternatively, if you are talking entirely about the piracy scene on 360  and have come to the conclusion that the people who created custom firmwares or Jtags are working for Microsoft, I'll get my tin foil hat immediately. Also, this is thread about Kinect hacking, not 360 modding, so that would be off-topic.

Been a while since I typed this much on a forum. Now if only I could get it in green text . . .

I can't see bolded on this computer so I don't know what part you're referring to. I'll simply refer to your responsen snowblind.

Let me make it clear how frustrated I am that you completely misunderstood everything I wrote.

1st paragraph: I didn't say in any way that these were microsoft employees screwing around on kinect in their spare time. You ASSUMED that for your own reasons. Case in point.

The very people that "hacked" this product in the OP (razorfish I believe their name is) are a marketing and design company who specifically tout having Microsoft as a client. The OP software "davinci?" is a Microsoft product. So to that extent, they have indeed been hired.

In another case, So Touch Air Presenter was developed by a Microsoft tech partner. 

My point is: these aren't underground hackers as they're being portrayed, they are skilled engineers hired to create and port these "hacks" under the guise of being just everyday people.

 

2nd paragraph:

I never said that they were creating piracy or in any way comparing piracy to the kinect hacks. I was comparing two ideas. I was saying that it is like releasing a piracy hack only to brick it several months later. I did not mean it in the way that these are hacks, but in the way that it is a company telling everyone in the market that they can play pirated games now, whereupon they sell many more consoles than they normally do, and then brick them. In that sense, the company justifies it because the bricked console both a) made them hardware profit, and b) gave a "trial" usage to an otherwise non-customer, whom may now be hooked to a certain game, or have developed an affection for the console. In this way, it is similar. 

3rd paragraph:

If you don't think it's a problem then fine. I mean there aren't laws against having corporations provide thousands of great reviews for their own products, or trolling tech websites to control damage. I find it amusing though, because in my experience, viral marketing (which is what this distinctly is) upsets people because it's basically a lie. It's a basic rule of viral. Don't get caught. So, you don't care. I don't think I care about your opinion then, snow. :P

4th paragraph:

Again, never did I say any of that happened. I'm equating those things to what I see. Artificial environments created by boosting sales or interest in a shady way.

I knew it! Before I even posted I knew you were gonna call me that

1st paragraph

Considering that this is a topic about hacking KINECT . . . and your response to daroamer was that you knew "3 Microsoft partners" (the assumption being "partners" refers to those who work for Microsoft)

The second point is that I'm not sure how they are being portrayed as underground hackers if they readily tout themselves as being a client of Microsoft. If these hackers are known to the public as being Microsoft's clients, then its not any of Microsoft's fault that they are being passed as underground hackers (I'm not even sure how the term "underground" can be used here, if razorfish or other hackers are releasing the hack by their common username/psuedonym.) Even then, I'm not sure how this could cause a negative appearence on Microsoft's part, since "hacking" the Kinect isn't illegal as they have done. Last I checked, graffiti was.

Paragraph Dos

The comparison then was poor. In one scenario the company is selling it's product to later "brick" it and turn it into a large plastic coaster. In the second, where Kinect is concerned nothing of the sort is happening, in fact Kinect's usage is being expanded on through use of a PC. If you didn't mean it like piracy, I'm not quite sure how this is in any way related to the topic? Its definitely possible that I thought you were talking about the topic at hand, which is why I assumed you were speaking of the hackers for Kinect.

3rd Paragraph

If this truly is simply viral marketing, it's done in a way that gives buyers or potential buyers even more (albeit pretty useless) ways to use their product. Personally I don't mind a type of marketing where I can get free apps . . . but who knows. And silly professor, everyone cares about my opinion. Everyone.

Ever.

This includes you.

4th Paragraph

Unless Microsoft has stated that they have nothing to do with the hackers creating their own apps, and then the hackers come right out and say they do, I'm not sure how we can say it's artificially created without putting on our ol' tins and calling it a conspiracy.