Angela Merkel = Hitler II?

[DirtyP2002]

steverhcp02 said:

DirtyP2002 said:

steverhcp02 said:

DirtyP2002 said:

without reading the whole thread:

This is not about becoming Christians. It is about Christian / western values.You have to see women as equals and accept they have the same rights like you do. That is something muslims have their problems with.

Of course this also counts for gay people or any other minority.

So what Merkel actually says is against discrmination and for an equal society. Now think again if this might be the standard the Nazis tried to achieve.

Reading comprehension FTW!

Yeah, and our country (USA) did a fine job of viewing blacks and women of equal value throughout its christian/western value dominated history. Please.

To act as though the "values" of the western world or christian world should be put on a pedestal i direct you to the catholic church and islamaphobia USA.

With your sarcasm you made the perfect point, even though you did not want to.

Christian / Western values have changed and evolved over the years. Islamist values did not.
Women / black people / gay people are all equal and live peacefully in one society. We don't have to discuss about the fact that this wasn't the case a couple of hundred years ago.

The Islamist values did not evolve like the Western / Christians. That is the whole point. Merkel wants them to accept these western / christian standards without losing their religion.

Right now we have areas, where only a handful of people speak German, women wear the burca and minorities are not welcome. Remember: Germans are a minority in these areas as well. So as a German you are not welcome in some parts of Germany. Scary thought, right?

And what of the Dr. murdered for practicing abortion? What of Timothy Mcvagh (sp?) who could easily have been labeled a christian terrorist?

The deeds of a few individuals do not represent a society of about 1 billion people!

The direct values of a religion or western culture are a direct result of the actions done in their names.What of western values such as strip clubs? What about legalized drugs in parts of Europe?

If you mean a society grows by the experiences it made, I agree. I don't get the second oart with StripClubs and drugs though

I know from first hand experience plenty of young women in college who still live and grew up in muslim homes who have more dating rights than women in strict christian homes of similar age. 

Sure there are always different ways to be a part of a religion and to interpret it. That is why we have protestants and catholics.

The problem is essentially you want to label huge groups of people and locations with such a broad stroke and it simply cannot be done as proven throughout history.  I don't! Broad strokes lead to extrapolation which is unjust in eithe rpositive or negative terms. Values should be taken at face value on individual human merit rather than lumping "islam hasnt evolved" and "christian values have evolved"

There is no doubt that Christian values / western societies and islam have evolved differently. Some countries are VERY strict when it comes to religion (Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan) and some are getting more and more western (Dubai / Saudi Arabia, Egypt). So it the statement islam hasn't evolved is a bold one. But you have to agree that the changes the christian / western societies went through in the last 200 years are much bigger and sustainable than the progress the islam made in the past 200 years. This is due to a smaller degree of technology and knowledge / information IMO.

For a decent discussion of this you have to understand that the largest sect of christianity, the catholic church, was responsible for one of the largest cover ups of child molestation by its priests and still to this day refuses to acknowledge its wrongdoings and protection of the violators. I agree. It is a shame. On the other hand Islam is treated less as a "group" and more of an interperatation of law, which is why there are various groups who abuse its law and teaching to further its goals of terror and fundamentalism. You simply cannot have a debate on "christian values" and "islamic values" and also ignore these facts.

Again the molestation were deeds of individuals. It is a shame and they should suffer a slow and painful death if you ask me, but maybe that is just me.

Look there are obviously different ways to interpret the bible. There is the catholic way and there is the protestant Martin Luther way. And probably thousand different ways in between. The age of Enlightment did change a lot of things.

Of course you can interpret the Koran in many different ways. But the Age of Enlightment has not happened in quite a few islamist states. Try to live an atheistic life in Iran. Might not work out well.

Now we have most of the Germans living an Atheistic life and they are confrontated with conservative muslims. That is the situation we are in right now.