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Icyedge said:
The Ghost of RubangB said:
Icyedge said:
Kantor said:

Tetris and Doom. i.e: The somewhat difficult ones

I think its more about the complexity of the gameplay/story than the difficulty to achieve good score. In my opinion you can be a hardcore tetris player but that doesnt make tetris an hardcore game. What do you think?

Story has nothing to do with it.  Any 2-D platformer is more hardcore than Heavy Rain or Metal Gear Solid 4.

Why not? I think an engaging story will help make a game hardcore. I think that because having an engaging story makes a game more complex. But, I dont mean that the story by itself will make a game hardcore. Now, can you explain why a 2D platformer is more hardcore than metal gear solid 4?

2d platformers and mgs4 exist on the same level. They are core games.

I think rubang was exaggerating a bit when he said that. Not all 2d platformers are on the same level as mgs.

See, mgs is very much a core game, because you play for core-like reasons. You are assigned a score at the end and a rank, you play to advance the story, and there is a skill measurement defined by the game itself.

A hardcore game should be mostly free of skill measurement, rather, it should let the gamer decide for themselves what the skill is. A good way this is done in a game like civilization 4, is that the game can measure any way in which you play it. Prefer fighting? That's fine, there's a way to define how skilled you are at conquering. Prefer diplomacy and culture? Good, same thing. Prefer a mix? That's fine too.

However, in a game like mgs4, compared with something like mario the score only increases when you do something the game wants you to do. For example, you only get points in Mario if you kill an enemy, or get a powerup. There is no score for not killing things and just running through the level. (except the time based score, but you can easily kill things and finish the level in the same amount of time. In fact, only by killing things can you possibly beat it in the fastest time). Same in mgs4. Your rank is based on how few times you are spotted, how few guards you kill, and how much the game is completed.

Anyway, I digress.