Decline and fall of the US.

[Badassbab]

Killiana1a said:

Badassbab said:

Killiana1a said:

Badassbab said:

Rpruett said:

Badassbab said:

America has been through doom and gloom before. Civil War and the Great Depression spring to mind. It will come back. Weaker than before since there are other rising world powers and economically it's not dominant like it is militarily but even militarily it's been challenged. It's having a tough time putting down the Taliban insurgency who are mostly armed with 40 year old Soviet weapons and have limited financing and this has hurt it's prestige.

Meh, Militarily we haven't been challenged in a long, long time.  Taliban insurgency is not related to military strength in anyway.  We could rumble through the Taliban blowing up every building, location and position where we think we would find terrorists.    We use restraint because this isn't a war as much as a transfer of power. This isn't military force as much as a police force.

Militarily, we rumbled into Afghanistan / Iraq and had virtually no resistance. 

Not really. I mean sure you could nuke every part of the country but that's not victory at all. Russia, Pakistan, India etc could do that. There are over 140,000 troops from the most powerful military body in the world with the most advanced weaponary against something like 40,000 odd Taliban armed with old Soviet arms. To not call the fight against the Taliban a war is ludicrous. It's known as the War in Afghanistan. And the US has been blowing up every building, location and position they think the enemy is in otheriwse they wouldn't be doing their job properly. And to say you rumbled through Afghanistan and Iraq isn't saying much. Iraq was incredibly weak through the Gulf War and UN sanctions and Afghanistan was hardly a military power and not even unified under the Taliban, in fact most of the foot soldiers fighting on the side of the US were from the Northern Alliance.

For the US putting down an insurgency is once again proving to be far tougher than winning a conventional war. I think in any conventional war the US would win though at great cost against some of the major powers.

I have a contrarian view on Afghanistan and Iraq:

Both were practice rounds for future urban conflicts for us and every participating nation who pledged troops.

Currently, August 2010 is the end of conventional military operations in Iraq. This has been noted in the media, but has flown under the radar.

As for Afghanistan, we are engaged in a civil war. The Taliban can be any Afghani citizen, but they dare not distinguish themselves with a uniform or noticeable piece of clothing because they would put a bulls eye on their forehead. Instead, they hide their weapons in the basement when the patrols come into town and then stone their wives and cut off the noses and ears of runaway brides once the patrols roll out.

What we should do in Afghanistan is prop up a pro-US dictator and give him carte blanche to root out and exterminate the Taliban like the rats they are.

As for the whole doom and gloom discussion, meh, the US is not the only nation feeling it at the moment. Europe, Japan and others are not doing as well as they were 5 to 10 years ago. We would be worse off as a planet, but fortunately we are not.

No you should not be propping up anymore dictators in any part of the world ever again. I long for the days when the 'propping up' artificial regimes by self righteous imperialist foreign powers comes to and end.

It worked in Iran until Carter was elected PoTUS. If Carter had given the Shah full support along with an unlimited supply of US munitions, then we would not be in the situation the world is facing now with a bunch of nutjob clerics running Iran and allowing that blowhard, Ahmadinejad to take the blame with his touting of a nuclear Iran.

As for propping up dictators, it makes sense in regions where they have a history of dictatorial rule and know nothing of democracy other than stuffing ballot boxes and assassinating opposition candidates.

In cases such as this, I fully support propping up dictators if it is in the best interest of world stability and averting a nuclear war. Yes, it may be antithetical to Western democracy and ideals, but some regions on this planet, due to their history, will never develop a democracy on their own, henceforth in the best interests of world powers, it makes cold-hearted political sense to prop up and support dictators.

If you mean propping up dictators works in the best interests of the American Elites then yes you're right. However I think the people should decide without foreign interference about who should be in power. Iran did have a democratically elected President in power in the 50's until the CIA and M15 engineered his overthrow. His crime? He put the interests of his people first and foremost above that of Western Corporations. Democracy only if they vote the 'right' way. And even if America is trying to export democray (which it's not) then surely there are better ways to do it then by bombing a country to smitherens and then occupying it for many years? Not exactly a good sell. And why not 'export' it to it's allies in the region that are anything but democracies? And those nutjob clerics you're talking about haven't invaded any country last I heard.

The reason for the lack of stability in the region is because of constant outside interference and artificial regimes in power propped up by the West. It's plain to see. And what nuclear war in the region are you talking about? Between whom? The only country threatening any country is the US and Israel against Iran which is completly illegal under international law. Iran is surrounded by an awesome array of firepower all around. It has a hundreds of thousands of US troops to it' east and west and a hostile powerful neighbour in Saudi Arabia and Israel. It spends less on it's military than most countries to it's West (and East even). Iran is hardly a threat. It's military is mostly defensive in nature with quite limited offensive capability. If there really was democracy in action then there wouldn't be any Foreign troops in the region.