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infamous23 on 20 June 2010
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1.  Khuutra said:

Resident_Hazard said:

 

Microsoft and Sony aren't "too stupid," they just don't feel like wasting their efforts on a genre that, these days, should be downloadable or on portable systems, and is a hard-sell as a full-fledged disc release.  But of course, you put Mario or something Nintendo-fanboyish in the thing, and you'll have those fanboys clamouring for it.

 

You are making two false statements here.

1. 2-D sidescrollers are not valuable enough to be disc releases. Again, this is the market's decision, not yours. The market disagrees immensely. Go figure.

2. Only Marioboys buy Mario games (ha-ha! Crazzyman). This is factually incorrect. 2-D Mario games appeal to much more than just the Nintendo hardcore. Again, sales speak all the difference, sicne NSMBWii will double the sales of the best-selling 3D Mario.

2. 

Resident_Hazard Yeah, I know, the fanboys will line up around the block to buy the latest shallow platformer with Donkey Kong in it, while I'm going to spend my money on games with depth like Fallout New Vegas, XCOM, and the like.  Well, okay, I'm probably going to snag that sweet Kirby game, side-scroller and all, it looks just too fun.  (Unless reviews reveal a short and pathetic performance.)

 

Oh wow, this is getting comedic now. Again you imply that only fanboys buy 2-D platformers (false), again you imply that 2-D platformers are necessarily shallow (false), and again you imply that you and your tastes are somehow above those of other consumers (especially false).

I think it's even worse that in the midst of this discussion about originality you managed to bring up a sequel to a derivative spin-off and another series that's over 15 years old. Are you being ironic or hypocritical? Inquiring minds want to know.

 

 

 

3. 

Also, I was going by IP's actually released by Nintendo, not that list of largely no-shows you had (some of that stuff was obscure owing to what I said... elsewhere or before how Nintendo doesn't support it's rare new IP's).  However, I will admit that going by "specific IP's," Nintendo has quite a few more than I said.  However, it doesn't help things that the vast majority of Nintendo's "new IP's" are either lame Wii-somethings, or built from an existing IP, i.e., Mario, Paper Mario, Mario Party, Mario Kart, Mario sports whatnots.  Lots of IP's, lots of lame.

 

You are making me into a broken record.

None of those IPs are new. Try again. Oh wait, you can't, because when you go back and acknowledge that Nintendo's new IPs are actually new IPs, you have to admit you're wrong! You came close to doing it. You came this close, and it would have been cool of you, and you would have gotten props.

No props for you.

 

 
 



1.  Sales are not actually accurate barometers of quality in all cases.  And many times they don't always reflect why a product was purchased.  If that was the case that quality equalled sales, then someone like Tom Waits or Lou Reed would have sold as many records as any other American musician in history by now.

Wii Sports is considered to be the best selling game of all time by this site, but many of its sales have to do with the fact that it was bundled with the Wii.  If Twilight Princess had been bundled with the Wii, then it would have just as many sales by now as Wii Sports.

New Super Mario Wii, for example, may have sold several million copies, but what do those sales actually say about the game?  Certainly many people that have a Wii for Wii Fit bought their kids NSMBWii for Christmas and have spent very little time playing NSMBWii themselves.  If so, what would that say about NSMBWii's quality?  Does it tell us that it's an excellent game for kids but not for the adults that bought it for their kids but only use their Wii for Wii Fit and have never played NSMBWii?  Do the kids really like it or was its purchase for them impulse buys based on advertising, price, or availability?  There are many ways in which sales don't give us an accurate indication of quality.

2.  Trying to dismiss Fallout 3, a game that many critics said was the best game of 2008 as a derivative spin off.  Actually Bethesda tried to take Fallout and make it into a 3d game world where gamers could experience those nuclearlly devastated lands much closer than they could in the earlier 2d versions.

It seems to smack of innovation to me.  I think from your prior arguments that you don't dismiss the 3d Mario games and Metroid Prime series as derivative spinoffs and instead would call them new series.

3.  What percentage of new ips or series on Wii from Nintendo would you say don't have the word Mario or Wii in their title in comparison to the new ips or series on Wii that have the words Wii or Mario in their title?