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jarrod on 10 May 2010
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NYANKS said:
jarrod said:
NYANKS said:
jarrod said:
Hero_time88 said:
jarrod said:
psrock said:
jarrod said:
psrock said:
jarrod said:
psrock said:
jarrod said:
Mazty said:
Nintendo could never beat Apple. Apple have better marketing and essentially better products. They may not be the best in the market e.g. their pad over others, but the build quality and accessibility are second to none. Plus they don't have any geeky stigma, especially with the iphone.

Nintendo makes better games though.  That's why they destroyed PlayStation this generation.

Nintendo did not make better games last Gen and the Gen before that, it's only this Gen they are starting to make better games, right ?

According to the market, yes.   The games on PlayStation and PlayStation 2 were preferable.  Now the games on Nintendo DS and Wii are preferable.

Sony made better games in PS1 and PS2 era than Nintendo but this Generation Nintendo is making better games thus the reason they are winning this Generation, right?

Who said anything about Sony?  I'm saying (in terms of the market) there were better games on PS1 than N64, and PS2 than GC.  Now there are better games on DS than PSP, and Wii than PS3.  

If you wanted to delve deeper, I'd also put forward that the best DS/Wii games, and the ones that have really driven the market, were almost all from Nintendo.  And the the best games on PS1/PS2, the ones that also really drove those markets, were mostly not from Sony.

Let me repeat what you said earlier " Nintendo makes better games though, that's why they destroyed the playstation this Gen" your words. Then you said the PS1/PS2 era the best games were not from Sony, right?  You are confusing me there. Sony still won two Gen without making better games than NINTENDO. In fact, they are losing badly the first time they realy competing with Nintendo when it comes to great games.

 

There's no confusion on my end, only misinterpretation on yours.  I'm saying Nintendo now, makes better games than everyone on PSP/PS3.  Everyone the previous two gens made better games than what Nintendo did on N64/GC.

You're wrongly equating Sony = PlayStation. That's rather obviously not my stance, and there's no inconsistency with what I've said.

 

 

Shouldn´t you replace `better´ with `appealing´?

In terms of the massmarket, I don't feel there's any real distinction there.  More 'appealing' is 'better'.

I think it's obvious why you're meeting resistance here.  For people who understand video game history and have great knowledge of software, appealing and better are quite different.  You are stating your interpretation while they have another one.  I think both are right.  The market finds the Wii and some of its games more appealing, but to "informed" people who comprehend the gamut of video game software, Wii games are not better. At least not the total domination you speak of.  For instance, there may be better portable music players, but the chance of them beating the ipod is minimal without incredible marketing. Quality isn't always the deciding factor, and too suggest otherwise is a bit irresponsible, I think.

Oh sure, "better" is quite open to interpretation. In fact "quality" would be another interpretation, though you could also make distinctions there especially when framed around the market (which is what I've been doing this whole time).

I'd also say your statement about "informed" people is hugely debatable though.  I'm hesitant to state that as an absolute, even among the "informed" Nintendo's games tend to rank pretty high.  Particularly with their pedigree brands (Mario, Zelda, Metroid, etc).

Oh I would never say Nintendo is not capable, they are one of the best developers in existence.  I actually think they and Sony are the two best.  See the fact that you bring up Mario, Zelda and metroid to indicate Nintendo quality illustrates a point to me.  They are absolutely some of the best games ever made.  But they are not the ones that are wowing the mass market and all these new fans that Nintendo has attracted.  It's the Wii series line that has done that (withsome definite help from New Super Mario Bros. Wii :P).  Maybe it's just a coincidence that you pick ed those certain games to highlight Nintendo's software quality, but still lol.  I think the "informed" topic needs some consideration, because this is real as it happens in all mediums.  Like you said though, you're speaking for the mass market, where more appealing may be better.  But it's opinion, again.  True you're idea may have more supporters (the mass market), but its more of a majority opinion than a fact.  Nintendo lost the N64 gen, didn't stop them from having what many of the "informed" consider the greatest, "best" game ever made.

Edit: In summation, I just feel it's not so black and white as you're stating.  Not wrong, just a convoluted topic.

Oh, the only reason I brought up Mario/Zelda/Metroid is because those are the 3 pedigree brands usually pointed to by industry press.  I wasn't making any "quality" statement myself.  Personally I think Wii Sports Resort is very much a high quality game for example.  But it's also not just the Wii Sports/Fit/Play games bringing in audiences (indeed Mario Kart and NSMB are pulling just as much weight sales wise).  And it's not just Wii I'm talking about either, it's DS as well with games like Pokemon, Mario Kart, Brain-Age, Nintendogs, NSMB, Animal Crossing, Tomodachi Collection (wait for it), etc.

I do think quality plays into it generally as well though.  Arguably the least critically successful Wii ____ game (Wii Music) failed to perform up to par with the others, so this goes for the massmarket too to some extent.  It's also likely why similar EyeToy games back in the mid 2000s didn't mimic Wii's success (and indeed why Move Sports/Party/etc won't either).  And you're right, even though consumers overall chose PS over N64, several of N64's top titles (Mario 64, Mario Kart 64, Zelda OOT, Goldeneye, etc) themselves actually sold on par with the best in the industry (and the best on PS1).