Tales of Innocence First Hour Impressions

[ItsaMii]

naznatips said:

ItsaMii said:

...

Why is the most annoying one missing? The female kid Hermana. where should I start?

1) They all have some sort of Megaman complex. The classic anime character with giant feet or shoes. Their hands are very unproportional to their feet size. Save for Ange they all have this characteristic. Google for Houshi Engi to see a really ridiculous giant feet complex.

2) Ridiculous and weird names that make no sense at all. Most Tales use real family names. Look at this one: Spada, Soldato, Hermana, Serena. These are very stereotypical views of non latin (derived) speaking countries. Imagine a game where characters had names like Emmanuel Hamburguer, Jonhy Tough, Shotgun Sullivan, Solidarity Foglianni.

3) Figures with small torso and giant lower body. All the girls and Ricardo have this issue. Iria is the most affected one, her design is ridiculous. Use a rule to get her ratios. Her Knees are bigger than her boobies.

4) Ruca and Iria weapons are too big for their size and weight. Ruca sword has a FF7/Berseck identity crisis (it is almost wider than him). Iria guns are almost the size of her arms. Compare those ratios to Ricardo`s whose gun (a rifle) is too small for his body. This is just to make him look more bad ass, so I won`t pick on him too much.

5) Spada and Ricardo are ok. I agree with you that they look good. Save for their Giant boots and Ricardo mammoth shapped legs (almost wider than his waist) they are not very different from other Tales.

6) You used a little cherry picking on Iria, Ange and Rucca. Maybe that is because you like Anime (for the most part I do not), so you do not see any problems. Iria do not look like any pirate stereotype I know. Rose from Zack and Wiki looks more like a pirate than her (even though she wears a schoolgirl skirt). Iria iseems to be missing a lot of pirate like acessories - parrot, eyepatch, hat, scars, wooden leg, hook, formal clothes(captains), nude chest (for small fry), boots. She does not need all of these to look like one, but look at her clothes: tennis shoes, stripped socks, tanktop, scarf and fashion belt. Rucca has some anime cliches also, but I have examined them already (boots, sword, formal clothes for a sword man). Swordmans use clothes that help them move. Save for MGS series, it would strange to see a soldier wearing a tuxedo and monocle in the battlefield (just an example). Ange outfit has a lot of details even compared to Collete. Her clothes change colors at some spots. There are a lot of details in the extremities (Collete is no different). She has a necktie. Even her amulet chain is very detailed and her shoes has some pearls. High Heels on Battlefield do not help also.

All that said. I DO NOT THINK THE GAME IS BAD. I just despise its character design. Psychonauts, Gears of War, Beyond Good and Evil, all have crappy (IMO) character designs but I love the games.

edit: Regal and Zelos clothes annoyed the hell out of me in TOS.

You're really digging for excuses on this one ItsaMii. It's okay if you don't like the art style, but you would have been better off admitting you made a mistake in calling it overly anime oriented.

Okay, to begin, I crossed it out every time you used the same argument in this. You were obviously digging for excuses, and disproportioned characters are hardly an anime norm. The really funny part about this one is the characters aren't actually disproportioned outside of the concept art. In game they look quite normal other than Ruca's large sword.

 

 

As you can see, the characters hardly have huge clown feet and hands. Even Ricardo's rifle is normal sized in proportion to his body. Now, that doesn't mean they are all the exact same size and proportions of adult humans, but they are normal in relation to their own bodies. Tales of Symphonia characters were obviously far shorter than adult humans, and had overly large feet, hands, and heads. These characters are much closer to normal proportions.

Red = Nice job.

Now for your mistakes on what you consider anime cliches:

1.) Disproportioned bodies are not an anime thing. They are a video game thing. Not that it's really an issue in this anyway, but you should be enlightened.

2.) Well dressed swordsmen are not an anime cliche. If anything, it's the opposite. Most anime swordsmen wear very lose clothing or robes. http://shodloer.free.fr/avatars/BLEACH/Bleach-ichigo.jpg http://discover-indo.tierranet.com/images%20japan/Kenshin06odw.jpg and finally http://iamotaku.files.wordpress.com/2007/04/mugen-outline.jpg

3.) Latin names are far from anime cliche. Very rarely do anime characters have names with latin roots. One example that comes to mind would be Edward Elric, but most are either named based of Japanese things (Naruto, Ichigo, Kira, Amuro, etc.) or are English words often symbolic of their purpose (Light, Cloud, Lightning). This game uses neither of those cliches.

4.) I hate to say it but you are completely full of shit on those being stereotypical names. There might be a slight argument for Ricardo, but you cherry picked the others anyway. You didn't mention Ruca and Iria, and her name isn't Serena it's Ange. Now, Lloyd and Collette might have arguments for awful Japanese interpretation of names with Latin roots, but Ruca, Iria, Spada, Ricardo, Hermano, and Ange are hardly racist stereotypes. You dug so far for this one that you came out in China.

If you don't like the art style, that's fine, but don't argue anime cliches with someone who constantly watches anime. You won't win.

Answer me: does my post story suggest that I dig for excuses? Why do you think I am pushing things? I took my time to add up everything anime related that I dislike in these character designs. Is there any need for insults? You should attack my arguments and ideas not myself. I would like to remember you that I had no problems in the past to admit I was wrong (when I truly was).

1) You have no idea what you are talking about when you say those names are not stereotypes. First of all you should know that racism and stereotype are different things. I never used the word racism or implied that it is present in the game. For example, a stereotype is saying that most mexicans wear sombreros and eat spicy food. Racism is to say that mexicans are worse/better than other nationalities/ethinic group.
Let me teach you something you already know (probably) about japanese names. In Japan, common words are used as names. So people named sword, dragon, cousin, rising star, wind from the north, sky, blue, green, love, hot springs are not strange at all. That means that using non-japanese words for the same purpose may not work and create really strange and awkward names (like ToI names). Hermana means sister. Spada Belforma can be rough translated into well shapped sword, in Japanese it would be a great name, but this is ridiculous for anyone that speaks a latin (derived) language. Soldato means soldier. If this was all in english, would you be ok with characters named Sister, Sword and Soldier? Ange Serena is not so bad, I may have pushed this one a little far. Even so, all these names are very different from the naming patterns of other Tales.
You are right about latin names not being anime cliches. Too bad I never said that, I said ridiculous and weird names. Misused latin names in ToI fits into weird naming anime cliche. ToI names may not even be the same on the US release. Remember Flea, Slash and Ozzie in CT? Their names were all different in the Japanese version. They were references to food (soy sauce, vinnegar and mayonaise). Peppita in SO3 was originally named Souffle. You may argue that these are all VG cliches, not anime, but I remember characters named Pudding and Parfait in anime. I used only food examples, but if you dig into this you will find several non-japanese words (mis)used as names.

2) When did you start depending on double standards? This is strange coming from you.

"The really funny part about this one is the characters aren't actually disproportioned outside of the concept art".
"You didn't mention Ruca and Iria".

The really funny part is that you used concept art to compare Lloyd and Colette to Ruca and Ange. What about ingame models? Why didn`t you mention the other characters?

I compared concept art to concept art because that is what you did in the first place. I have not played ToI yet. All I know (and dislike) are the names and characters from the japanese trailers. Also, I won`t mention the characters if they are irrelevant to my arguments. Iria and Ruca names do not sound strange like the others. Ricardo and Spada clothes fit them very well.

3) What do you mean by saying disproportioned characters are hardly an anime norm, they are a video game thing? They may not be anime exclusive, there are disproportional characters in cartoons, comic books and video games. Even so, this is one of the defining characteristics of anime. You should never think of yourself as an anime authority if you stand by this claim. Unrealistic characters are not a problem in itself, I just dislike these kind of characters. If this art style is not from anime, could you tell me where they come from? I have seem this huge feet and hands style in anime before. Giant swords and big ass guns are present in so many animes that you did not even bother stating otherwise.

4) I made a mistake in the swordman formal clothes thing. I should have said clothes that do not fit the character job/function. I do not want to go deep into that matter because it is a minor thing to my arguments and this is present in all Tales. You win.

Summing it up.

 

I dislike the naming and art style in this game. I blame it on anime influence. I use as evidence the names and design. I will say this again look for Houshi Engi to see similar unrealistic characters.

 

You think this is not related to anime at all. You said disproportioned characters are not from anime (I think you made a mistake here, you probably mean something else). You also misinterpreted my naming arguments on points 3 and 4. You also think I am full of shit and just making excuses (this is harsh and not very mature).