Jaffe: ’storytelling not cracked properly yet’

[Reasonable]

rocketpig said:

Cryoakira said:

Reasonable said:
Sorry guys, but ME has good storytelling for a videogame but pretty weak storytelling in context to other mediums.

But why do you need to compare to other mediums ?

storytelling in games isen't anything like movies or books. In fact, I believe great movies stories will be very weak in games context, simply because many tools used by scenarist are lost in games. 

VG storytellers must answer to very different constraints. The player control the pace of the game, not only when he plays, but also when he stops (not like watching TV episodes). Building intensity, emotional rythm, climax and such, is WAY harder (if not impossible). Some games run for 50+ hours and you have to keep things both interesting and clear. Many games allow a freedom that requiere fragmented story parts that can be assembled by the player in a non linear way (even if the outcome of the plot is forced) and that's something that doesn't really exist in movies.

VG, while they can learn some storytelling tricks from movies and books, should not try to follow the same path at all.

And let's not forget, as it was said in the original video, that you have two very different kind of "story-games". One is about telling the story of a character (Kratos for instance) to the player, the other about letting the player make its own story through an avatar. Once again, the means and ends are very different. What Jaffe said is very interesting, but IMO, doesn't apply to the two.

At some point, you can already see the "natal's slap" approach in ME2, when you can interrupt a scene with an instant action, and it works pretty well.

 

Games deserve to be compared to other media because they've try to hard to BE those other media. Some games still do it through mindless gameplay interrupted by long narrative sequences to move the story forward. Virtually no story progression happens in an interactive environment. This disjointed form of gaming is HORRIBLE at telling a story because the player is constantly being jerked from one environment to another.

As I said earlier, I think less "storytelling" needs to happen in games and more "experience" needs to happen. Don't worry about the pre-determined story so much as how the player gets there and how he or she changes the game environment in the process. In itself, that will help the player make a "story" their own without hurdling the difficulties of forcibly inserting narrative to get things moving again.

Yah, I agree right now.  Over time complexity might come - particularly with more power and better coding techniques - but right now what can be improved is the experience.

I've played three games (Mass Effect 2 may well be number 4 but I want to replay it a few times to get a better feel) that for me used a basically set narrative to allow for player experience and change:

Deus Ex

ICO

Sillent Hill 2

 

ICO has the simplest premise, and in fact you can't change much, but the interaction is superb and seamless and it's a great example of using a familiar canvas (a fairy tale essentially) married with simple, easy to master and invisible gameplay mechanics to deliver an amazing experience that is the equal of any filmed, acted or written based one.

Deus Ex has the most complex premise, a huge sprawling techno-conspiracy thriller (still unequalled IMHO) but it allows you to seamlessly make choices and affect the story without prompts.  Maybe you're tasking with an assassination.  There are no prompts, no moment to ponder the mechanics, you simply use the invisible mechanics you know (do I shot this person, do I lower the gun, turn and walk out, or do I turn on those who instructed me?) and once the choice is made it's made.  The rest of the story changes (no in overall shape, but in the details).  This welded to a fair bit of choice through fairly open levels really made you feel there and that you were in command.  You could walk in the front door, check round the back, try hacking a terminal to see if it opens a secret passage, and all without breaking the immersion.

Sillent Hill 2.  This is my favourite example of invisible choices.  Throughout the game, without even being aware of it, you are carefully put in the position of making choices, and they matter in the end because they add up, they have impact, and finally they determine how the story ends, what happens to you, all within a fixed overarching narrative.  A fake example might be rescuing someone from a locked room, how long you take, how you do it, and how you treat them afterwards all affects the story without a single prompt or you even being aware of it.