Is Magna Carta 2 The Best JRPG Since Tales of Vesperia?

[Kenryoku_Maxis]

selnor said:

Kenryoku_Maxis said:

selnor said:

sc94597 said:

selnor said:
Wow. RThis thread went downhill with unecessary posts by people who will never play MC2. And Demon Souls by reviewers is said like Oblivion. Um Oblivion was as far from a JRPG as you can get. MC2 is JRPG!

Right let actual players comment. From what I understand it's actually a good game. Isn't that good for a JRPG?

Demon Souls looks nothing like oblivion. I don't care what reviewers say, it just isn't. Demon Souls plays more like a Japanese Action-Adventure mixed with Japanese Role Playing. You might get confused since Western RPGs are similar to Action-Adventures, but it is what it is, and that isn't a WRPG.  Like somebody mentioned earlier, MC2 is more similar to Korean MMOrpgs, which root themselves in Western Role Playing games than it is similar to Japanese Role Playing game. Either way, like I said earlier, the genres are merging back together, and pretty soon they are going to be one and the same again.

 

Key Things I would like to note when determining what genre a game is in.

- ALWAYS look at gameplay first and foremost. Do not look at story and say, this one is linear, that one isn't, they must be in such and such genre.

-  Do not confuse persective with the genre it takes place. An example that I would love to note. The Metroid Prime series isn't a first person shooter. This is because it plays like it's predecessors, an action adventure. So just because a perspective is more popular in one genre, that doesn't mean all games that use this perspective are in this genre.

- Try to stick to the major groups first, then narrow it down. The major groups are  Action, Adventure, Action-Adventure, RPG, Strategy, Simulation, and a few less broad ones like Puzzle or Rythm.

Action can be narrowed down into shooting, hack n slash, fighter, platformer, etc.

Adventure can be narrowed down into Point and Click adventures, and Open World adventures.

Action-Adventure could be  survival horror, or just regular action-adventure, mostly categorized by their perspective and specific gameplay aspects at this point.

RPG - Traditional(Turn based), Real time are the first major distinctions. Then you could go even more into Sandbox, Linear, Sectioned, etc that describe how much freedom you have.  I would say RPG shouldn't even be considered a genre. The games should be split into strategy, and action-adventure. There just isn't enough to differentiate some games from genres in other groupings, yet be so far apart from other RPGs.

Strategy - Turn Based(could go more into Strategy RPG), Real time.

Simulation - Pretty much whatever the game is simluating.

So yeah, it gets complicated, but I think that helps.

 

I disagree completely.

JRPG's arent really RPG's and never have been. The ONLY part of RPG they imitate is a level system.

JRPG's do not have multiple choices. Do not have create a character options. Do not have interaction with scenery ( except for what is story driven ). RPG's come from the original RPG pen and paper games. Where RPG's started. JRPG's have as much in common with these as Killzone 2 does. A level system thats it. Now I havent played Demon Souls, but what the reviews have said have next to sweet FA to do with JRPG's. And MUCH more akin to RPG's. ( I dont call them WRPG's anymore because, they are what the RPG originally was. )

I smell a typical JRPG vs WRPG fight coming.

And I love it when people start dropping the 'absolutes'.  There's always examples to prove an absolute statement wrong.  JRPGs don't have multiple choices?  What a vague statement.  Multiple options in story paths? (Suikoden, Fire Emblem, Chrono Trigger, etc)  Multiple options in character customization? (Dragon Quest, Seiken Densetsu, nearly any SRPG, etc) Seriously come on.

And as it has been stated multiple times, no video based RPG has ever created an experience mimicking Dungeons and Dragons 1:1.  That doesn't make them 'non-RPGs'.  That's like saying you can't classify a basketball game as a 'sports' game unless you're really playing actual Basketball.  Or a shooter as a shooter unless you're out playing actual paintball/shooting real guns.

In other words, if you have to go back to the source of a genres namesake to discredit the rest of a genre, then you're just grasping as straws.  And the same can be done for any genre.

This is not a direct answer to you, but what you describe is what I consider splitting hairs. I dont live in absolutes. But there is my mind no way a JRPG can really be considered a true RPG. Some have slight differences to each other, but IMO the JRPg's I have played have ALOT more in common with point and click adventures than RPG's. I feel like they are point and click adventures with a level/battle system. A traditional RPG is layered with choices. Not just you can do this or do that. But rather do what you want. Also RPG stands for Role laying Game. Where you play the role of A character. determining it's status, bloodline, strengths weaknesses etc. NOT a Party of people. Bioware are the closest devs to a true RPG experience in Video games. Bethesda also very impressive in this area.

Well first of all, you did use absolutes and still are (see bold).  You may think you're stating only general statements or even only citing a small percentage of games you have played, but you're not referencing those games.  And even then, you're using those games you have played to represent all JRPGs as a genre.

In any event, I stand by what I said.  No video based RPG has delivered a DnD based RPG experience.  And the reason is because they introduced things like story and graphics to the experience, which were created by the games developers.  Where in Pen and Paer RPGs, the players had total control over those properties.  While you think I might be splitting hairs, I think you need to go back and analyze the gripes you have with JRPGs and see many WRPGs are also at fault for this, including having multiple party members and focusing on story over character customization. 

While you may think some WRPGs got closer to your idea of what a 'true' RPG experience is, that doesn't make JRPGs inferior or 'non-RPGs'.  And just because you haven't played a JRPG that has good character customization and balance, etc, doesn't mean they aren't out there.  As we have already given examples in this thread.

naznatips said:

loves2splooge said:
MagnaCarta II may be great or it could be a flop, who knows, but it's pretty obvious that you're not very objective either and have ulterior motives after taking that dig at 360. You hate Microsoft, we get it. Anywho I didn't see that 6.1 review on metacritic (I never seen this review anywhere either) nor do I see this 4.4 one on metacritic. So two small-time reviewers rate the game poorly. Doesn't say much. It has a 80 and a 70 on metacritic. I doubt this is going to be a critical success (not that I personally care about the scores. I pay attention more to what they say about the game. If I paid attention to scores only instead of looking into WHY the reviewers rate them good/bad and looking at previews/footage and more detailed fan feedback, I would have overlooked many great games.) But for gamers that want a change of pace from the usual jrpg fare, perhaps MagnaCarta II is worth looking into. I'm interested to see what the upcoming english reviews are going to say about this. Particularly IGN and Game Spot (not that they are perfect).

Dig at 360? Pointing out that there's a 360 JRPG that's better is a dig at 360? I'm an all platform owner. Every handheld, every console, and a gaming PC. Don't you dare try to lower me to your level of bullshit console fued. If you want to talk about the game, talk about the game, but a shitty game is a shitty game no matter what console it's on. I know that's can be hard to admit if you only own one and feel starved for games on it, but from where I stand I don't really give a damn what console it's on. As for it being a change from the "standard JRPG fare" that 4.4 says that the problem is that it is a mediocre standard JRPG.

Oh and the 61/100

http://www.n4g.com/xbox360/News-408687.aspx

Get over yourself, your stupid console wars, and your preconceptions of this game, and open your eyes and take a look around.

While I applaude your devotion to owning multiple consoles, citing game review sites as the basis of showing why a game is 'good' or 'bad' is not exactly solid proof.  They could say a game is only a 7.5 or even lower, but it could be a persons favorite game.  And, as we've seen a lot recently, they could give a game a score of 9.5 or even a perfect 10 and fans could give it a collective 'meh'.