| Sqrl said: I'm not saying you explicitly stated that here, I'm just laying out my argument. |
But your argument seems predicated on this idea that I'm defending a belief that... I don't think I've ever advocated. This seems to all come down to your definition of "atheism"; you think that, because I describe myself as "atheist" and not "agnostic," that must mean that I am claiming that god does not and can not exist. But I'm not claiming any such thing; only that I have no belief in any god or gods.
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If you believe it is simply a difference in terminology then there is no real issue here...and from what you've said I think you probably are agnostic and not atheist. |
Well, I think that it is primarily a difference in terminology. However I am quite certain that I am an atheist. I think that it's at least possible that "atheism" is a bit broader than you're allowing for...
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I'm not sure how to approach this other than to say that atheism is just that. Consider the word for a moment... atheism is literally anti-theism..the opposite of being a theist (I doubt anyone would deny that theists use faith as the basis for their belief). Atheism is, at its core, rejecting the idea that there could be a god or gods. |
An entymology of "theist" (from etymonline.com):
Theist: 1662, from Gk. theos "god" (see Thea) + -ist. The original senses was that later reserved to deist: "one who believes in a transcendant god but denies revelation." Later in 18c. theist was contrasted with deist, as allowing the possibility of revelation. Theism "belief in a deity" is recorded from 1678; meaning "belief in one god" (as opposed to polytheism) is recorded from 1711. Theistic is attested from 1780.
Description of the prefixes a- and anti- (from Wikipedia):
| a- | (Native) | lacking in, lack of | asexual, anemic |
| a- | (Neo-Classical) | not, without | anemic, asymmetric |
| anti- | (Native) | against | anti-war, antivirus, anti-human |
| anti- | (Neo-Classical) | opposite | anti-clockwise |
Definitions of "atheism":
(from Wikipedia): Atheism is the philosophical position that deities do not exist, or that rejects theism. In the broadest sense, it is the absence of belief in the existence of deities.
(from Dictionary.com): 2. a lack of belief in the existence of God or gods
(from infidels.org; the site linked to earlier): Atheism is characterized by an absence of belief in the existence of gods.
(from askanatheist.org): An atheist is a someone that does not believe in God (or gods) -- but you already knew that. What you might not know is that most atheists don't think that there is proof that God doesn't exist.
(from atheistfaq.com): The basic definition of an atheist is "Someone who has no god-belief." That's it. This is a descriptive definition, specifically a description of an absence. It makes no positive claims of any sort, it simply describes someone in whom divine belief is absent.
(from wiki.answers.com): A (without) + theist (belief in a god) = without belief in a god. An atheist is one who does not believe in the existence of a god(s). [...] By definition, atheism does not exclude agnosticism, because atheism is anything but theism, the expressed belief in a god or gods. Agnosticism and atheism are not separate categories, because atheism is not even a category. It is the exclusion of a single category, theism.
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Atheism is not necessarily the kind of "anti-theism" you take it to be. Instead, it is more like "without-theism."
While there are some people, and some sources, who take the position that you seem to argue against--a claim that no god can possibly exist--it isn't the position that I claim or, to the best of my knowledge, have ever claimed.
Such a claim is also not synonymous with "atheism," even though some atheists do make it.
