I'm so SICK of "bad ass" characters, dialogue, storylines and art design.

[rocketpig]

drboot said:

rocketpig said:

badgenome said:

I dunno, this is a pretty old gripe. My feeling has always been that there are plenty of JRPGs that are just as cookie cutter and cringe-inducing. Just because the characters are all limp-wristed and fey doesn't make them any more original than the stereotypical bald space marines about whom certain segments of the gaming community always seem to be bitching.

I love Gears!

Agreed. Just as most FPS protagonists are hardcore "bad-asses", JRPG protagonists tip the scale in the other direction, often whining, moping, and dragging their asses from battle to battle with obnoxiously long introspective moments in between.

Some of the hardcore bad-asses don't bother me... Marcus being one of them. He gives off a feeling of "just get this over with" because he's been through so much in his life. The attitude fits. He just doesn't give a shit anymore. Many other protagonists abuse this idea but for some reason, it never irritated me with Fenix.

Most videogames are poorly written, no matter their origin. Picking on the "bad asses" is unfairly turning your eye on one small segment of a mountain of fermenting shit.

Oh, and Raiden was a horrible character. There's a difference between an emotional character and one you want to punch in the face because he won't shut up about how much he questions his existence, the world, and whatever else he happens to stumble across during battle. That's no better than one who screams "I'm gonna rip your f---ing throat out!" every time he steps into a fight. One dimensional, poorly written, and lame.

Nico from GTAIV is a much more fully developed character than Raiden and even he made me want to throw my controller at the television during points of the game.

 

How is an introspective character that questions his identity and the nature of his existence (which was the entire game was set up to do) one dimensional?

Raiden is the pinnacle of character development done right in gaming. He begins his mission cocky, "I'm the shit" kind of attitude. In truth we learn through various conversations with Rose that he is actually an insecure person, who questions his identity because of his upbringing as a child soldier without a real family. Once he broke away from his environment he creates a new persona -as suggested by Freud in the case of someone who escapes through dissaciation from the realities of life-. Because Raiden has been mentally and emotionally scared all his life he creates a cocky, "I'm the shit" attitude to hide his own vulnerabilities as a way to prevent others getting close to him -exploiting him and taking advantage of him as has been all his life. The empty room he sleeps in also speaks of this among many other aspects it symbolizes. Like Rose said, he only sees the things he wants and hides from the truths that conflict with the faux reality he has created for himself. An empty room contains no record of his identity, the one that he wishes to hide from, but it also symbolizes that he still has the ability to grow and take control over his own life, to grow and mature. -The empty room and white hair, admitted even by Kojima represents that sort of existential virginity that Raiden (and everyone) still has.

The confusion and manipulation of the Big Shell incident forces him to begin questioning his mission and those around him supplying him with false information -He begins doubting himself, in psychology it would be the equivalent of a "catharsis". -The uncertainties of his mission evoke the hidden uncertanties and vulnerabilities of his repressed persona. This is the part of the game where most people hate him because he comes off as an insecure "bitch".

During the final scenes of the game he manages to overcome his inner struggles by facing up to his past and present, because he has no where left to run on the Big Shell. He matures into a self assured man with a purpose, one capable of facing up to difficult questions and searching out the answers -the "truth" himself. He takes control of his own life, to forge his own future, his own identity -rather than let circumstance and environment (child soldier then big shell) control him any longer.

One could fill a book on the incredibly rich development of Raiden. The above is a very very general overview. MGS TUS just came back online, there are already numerous huge documents on the symbolism, thematic and character analysis of MGS2 and there will be more soon as people find the site again and submit their articles.

MGS2 and Raiden are among the most layered narratives/characters in the history of any medium, not just games. One dimensional? I don't see how.

 

I've mentioned my opinions on MGS and its "themes" on these forums more times than I care to count. If you want my opinion on the series, just site search it. In short, I think the story and characterization is ham-handed and convoluted.

Just because a character talks a lot doesn't mean he/she is not one dimensional.