| Comrade Tovya said:
Okay, ONCE again... You: "Israel must make the first real step. It must free up restrictions and actually hold a real truce." Israel went on a 100% truce, and Hamas still fired rockets into Israel. You: "It must state sit down with the Arab league (or a select influential group) and fundamentally agree to the premise that it will give back Golan Heights and the greater majority of WB." The Golan Heights has nothing to do with the Palestinians, and only the Syrians which is not party to this particular "peace process" You: "It must state that while Right of Return is an impossibility, it will give $$$$$$ and specific details of assistance to rebuild Palestine." Israel does this now. It provides economic aid at this moment, even though the Palestinians call Israel "the enemy". Therefore, it can be safely assumed, that should the Palestinians called israel, "our friend", then at the very least economic aid would remain, but more than likely increase. Hell, half of the planet's free-market economies have poured (and continue to pour) money into the Palestinian territories, but the Palestinians keep destroying their own industry. After Israel withdrew from Gaza (in Gush Katif) they left behind an intact agricultural infrastructure, and the Palestinians came in and on day one destroyed the greenhouses... so, your point in kind of mute. They were given the agricultural industry as a gift from the EU, and the Palestinians destroyed it. That's just ignorant.
You: "Above all the Palestinian trying to grow his olives must be able to actually see real hope in their future." The first "hope for their future" starts in their own backyard. They need to disposses the Hamas leadership that continues to tear down what their own people build. Bitch about the Israelis all you want, but it looks foolish when you elect a leadership that has promised you that they intend to bring war... if the Palestinians want hope, they need to embrace peace as the first option. And they have not done this.
You: "It must crack down on settler and IDF violence with a zero tolerance policy." IDF "violence" as you call it is a response to terrorism and rockets being fired into Israel. Stop strapping bombs on your kids and shooting rockets at schools, and then there is no reason for the IDF to respond to such threats.
you: "Israel has to make the first moves. They hold all of the cards." Israel made the first move, they have declared one truce after another, and remained non-reactive to terrorism... but you can only remain silent for so long. Palestinians hold all of the cards, because if they Palestinians renounced violence as a means to independence, they would already have a country. But, as the Palestinian leadership readily admits, their goal is not simply a Palestinian nation, their goal is a nation from "the river to the sea". They will not accept a Jewish nation in the midst of pan-Arabia. So the only way the Jews can ever get peace is if all Israelis pack their bags and move out of the middle east... which is not going to happen, and therefore, the Palestinian leadership will never accept peace from the "Jewish infidel" in their midst. Hence, war shall remain a standard in the region until one side completely defeats the other. Is it ideal? No, but Muslims cannot accept a Jewish nation in their midst, and hence there can be no peace. |
okay, ONCE again your complete denial of any Israeli wrong doing is why the peace process never goes forward. You are just like Hamas, the settlers, all of the quotes from various leaders of Israel, etc. You have no ability to see past your wall of hate.
I have routinely said things the Arabs have done wrong. I just listed a well thought out plan that gives Israel what it desires at as much a cost to Arabs as I realistically think they would agree to.
What do you do? You take on the PR war again.
How can you call Israel as upholding the truce when they effectively starve all of Gaza? I'm not just talking about food, but electricity, heat, fuel, etc. How could anyone expect Hamas or any Gazan to just sit there in that form of a truce forever? Your right, Israel didn't break the truce. There was never one to begin with. Israel never started to follow it.
I mentioned Golan Heights because I was referring to a peace solution with the entire region, not just Palestinians. Afterall if you expect any kind of stable neighbor you will need as much Arab support for the entire region as possible to ensure the remaining hardline radicals like Hamas are surpressed by everyone.
You mention Palestinians must dispose of Hamas, how? Israel is the one who created them. Why can't you understand that? They are a byproduct of a hopeless nation after decades of brutality. Not only do the give the illusion of military action and protection, but they also provide very real humane necessities to the people. Where PA is very corrupt and does very little, Hamas is not and builds tons of schools, hospitals, roads, etc. That is why the won a landslide victory in the elections. When Israel's aggression is gone, so too will Hamas' ability to make war.
The IDF violence is exactly as I described it. There are no rockets at the hundreds of checkpoints throughout the WB. There are no bombers in Arab villages when the settlers rampage through and the soldiers turn the other way. Not a single militant has come from my wife's family village, yet her brothers all realized this violence before the age of 8. An 8 year old shouldn't fear walking to school because one of the many soldiers they pass may hit them.
Israel did make the first moves, your right. They moved into Gaza and WB. Thankfully they have left Gaza. Now they need to start moving out of the parts of the WB that is obviously not going to be part of a final deal.
