So who do you want to run against Obama in 2010?

[Comrade Tovya]

akuma587 said:

Comrade Tovya said:
I'm actually a pretty open minded guy overall.. I'm pretty moderate on most social issues, but wow, do you ever say anything nice about any conservative?

She actually was quite competent, and did a very nice job in the debate against Biden.

But I've already talked enough to you between this thread and the other thread, to know well enough that anyone with a conservative outlook, either fiscal or social, will get a thumbs down on every detail by you.

Just because a liberal disagrees with a principal of mine doesn't mean I can't see their good points as well. I have the ability to say kind words about people, including liberals. I don't see the world in black & white, as there are gray areas as well.

Oh come on, it's reasonable to say that Palin is a passable politician, but she is by no means well-versed on the issues.  Her debate performance was little more than a recitation of a script (which she essentially admitted during the debate).  This may change in four years if she gets some training, but she certainly was not the epitome of social policy and foreign policy expertise on the campaign trail.  If I were grading her, I'd say the best I would give her was a C+.  At least she did better than Dan Quayle.

And Jackson is a libertarian and has one of the most consistently fiscally conservative viewpoints out of anyone on this website.  I am frankly surprised that so many fiscal conservatives have stood by the Republicans, as Republicans have turned fiscal conservatism into a mockery of what it used to be pre-Reagan and ESPECIALLY pre-Bush the W.

Essentially fiscal conservatism as the Republican Party has defined it in the last decade or two is low taxes and lax regulations.  Not low spending, and not necessarily less government (although they consistently beat the anti-government drum).  Spending money you don't have is the exact opposite of fiscal conservatism.  At least the Democrats are willing to collect money first and then spend it.

My main complaint about the Republicans on economic policies as of late is that they act like taxes are the absolute devil.  If it was up to them, we probably wouldn't pay any.  Don't ask me how the government would run itself if that were true.  The Republican Party has essentially developed what I call the "tax-cut reflex."  If an economic problem arises, they bandy about the idea of a tax cut.  When the financial crisis on Wall Street happened, some of them recommending cutting taxes on the very institutions they were about to put taxpayer money into.  It's become ridiculous to the point where they are like Pavlov's dogs.  I could ring a bell and they would probably shout out "tax cuts!"

I am not against tax cuts in the least, but why the hell would you cut taxes while the deficit is soaring?  Even George Bush Sr. knew that was just plain stupid and called it "voodoo economics."  Republicans need to get their act together on fiscal policy.  Its ridiculous now that they are clamoring about the Democrats spending taxpayer money (during a recession, when the government does actually have justification to spend more) while they ran up deficits on a yearly basis during good economic years (while a member of their own party held the Presidency no less).  Its just plain ludicrous that Republicans still act like they are fiscal conservatives when their actions clearly reveal that they are not.

 

 

Ok, first and foremost, let's not dip into the "scripted" politician subject, because it's well known the Obama was the "tele-prompter" candidate this election.

Secondly, Biden continued to provide false answers as the debate raged on.... which is something that is provable, unlike the assertion that Palin was "coached".

As for "fiscal" Republicans, I actually agree with most of what you say about them.  They are not conservative enough for my tastes.  But in all fairness, on the reasons for spending by both Reagan & the lastest Bush, they were both associated with war (Reagan's Coldwar & Bush's War on Terror). 

This bailout that Bush so adamently pushed for was the straw that broke the camels back for me.  I think the bailout is a crock, and waste of our money, whether it be inflationary or tax wise.

As for your assertion, "[Republicans] act like taxes are the absolute devil.  If it was up to them, we probably wouldn't pay any", that is just absurd.  No Republican has ever called for or supported the concept of zero taxe.  True fiscal Conservatives believe in trimming the fat from the budget, thus freeing up funds for tax breaks.  Examples of wasteful spending include:

* Unused flight tickets and double paying for the same tickets (instead of getting refunds on fully refundable tickets) for a total of $100-million

* Government employee credit card fraud for purchases that include, but are not limited to, Ozzy Ozborne concert tickets, lingerie, etc, in some departments the credit card fraud totaled $5.8-million

* Medicare waste.  There are documented cases of Medicare paying out 8 times more for a single item than other branches of the government do.   One such example is Saline solution, where Medicare was paying over $8.00 per bottle, and the Dept of Veterans Affairs was only paying $1.02 for the same bottle.  Outdated cost database?  Fraud?  Who knows?  Either way it's a waste of taxpayer funds.

* $21.8-billion dollars in defaulted government backed student loans.  A large number of the defaulted loans are a result of fraud, because that agency is no actually verifying information prior to authorizing the funds.  They are often rubber-stamping loan requests to fake students by fake colleges that don't even exist. 

* Duplicate government agencies performing the same duties.  Once a new one is created, the old one is never fazed out or consolidated into the new agency... examples include:

    *
      342 economic development programs;
    *
      130 programs serving the disabled;
    *
      130 programs serving at-risk youth;
    *
      90 early childhood development programs;
    *
      75 programs funding international education, cultural, and training exchange activities;
    *
      72 federal programs dedicated to assuring safe water;
    *
      50 homeless assistance programs;
    *
      45 federal agencies conducting federal crimi­nal investigations;
    *
      40 separate employment and training pro­grams;
    *
      28 rural development programs;
    *
      27 teen pregnancy programs;
    *
      26 small, extraneous K–12 school grant pro­grams;
    *
      23 agencies providing aid to the former Soviet republics;
    *
      19 programs fighting substance abuse;
    *
      17 rural water and waste-water programs in eight agencies;
    *
      17 trade agencies monitoring 400 interna­tional trade agreements;
    *
      12 food safety agencies;
    *
      11 principal statistics agencies; and
    *
      4 overlapping land management agencies

Long story short, it's not tax-cuts alone, but rather trimming the fat, freeing up funds, and thus having the ability to cut out taxes.  That is what fiscal conservatism is about.