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Mr.Y said:

And if the complex game isn't challenging how is it different than the casual game where "A game seeming or tending to be indifferent to what is happening; apathetic; unconcerne" ?

how about this. instead of brazenly just stating the opposite of these thoughts, why don't you give me some examples?

i think your problem is that you think any casual game can be hardcore and any hardcore game can be casual.

i think the perfect example of that quote you just put down there is solitare; it has nothing to do with the times, it is simple, will not really challenge ideals, or alter your thought process.

 what complex game isn't challenging?