Do you believe in god?

[appolose]

Sqrl said:

appolose said:

So, in effect, you're saying that there wasn't any measurable time (or that it was infinitely fast) due to the lack of matter, yes?  In that event, I think another discussion would follow (started by me) on how the universe could show up in any consistent sense (in the definition of time).  Also, I would consider the study of time (otherwise, your word (which, again, I do not take lightly)) to be far too unfounded to be used in a science debate.  But in that event, I think my own redundancy and confusion would be going nowhere, so we may just have to leave this point at this stage.

 

 

Hmm, I was just going through the possibilities as I understand them, it wasn't really intended to be taken as statement of fact so much as a listing of possible scenarios. I was trying to show that in a large number(all?) of possible creation scenarios there still exists a possibility for the natural creation of the universe.

I absolutely agree that our understanding of this topic as a civilization isn't far enough along to draw any solid conclusions on the matter.  If I felt we could draw firm conclusions I probably wouldn't be arguing this from an agnostic viewpoint to be honest, I see this issue as fundamental to the question.

 

 

Sorry, I didn't mean to say it like you were claiming them fact; I should have said "may" in place of "would" (no sarcasm here, in case it sounds like that).  Also, I should have mentioned that I was fine using time as we have observed it; that is, aside from pre-modern universe/0 dimensional etc.; my main contention was that the possiblities you gave I considered too speculative to weigh against what I think is a more observed understanding of time.  However, there seems to be plenty of things we've observed about time already, so my point could be on shakier grounds (but I don't know).