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Forums - Politics Discussion - Veteran soldiers suicides why is this big issue still not solved?

Aeolus451 on 30 May 2017
WolfpackN64 said:
Aeolus451 said:
1. People have become softer because society condemns any violence even when it's justified. We've become so sensitive to it that a lot of people have trouble coping with carrying it out. Testing to see if a person mentally able to handle it before putting them into a combat role would be the easiest way around the oversensitive people.

2. Lack of proper healthcare for vets.

Btw, obama tried to do away with vets' healthcare but people got mad at him so he downgraded the military's healthcare instead.

So people commit more suicide because they're softer? Violence when it's justified? Tell me, how many justifiable wars has the US joined in the last 10 years? Seems like you don't really appreciate your veterans.

I appreciate them fine but I prefer to be honest and practical about what is causing this sort of stuff. I'll elaborate a bit more. American society bashes violence all the way from the weakest form of it to the highest. In other words, as a general rule, modern society conditions us to not be violent with the aim to erase violent tendacies from people (not possible) but it sensitizes them to it. When we have to commit violence, our minds have a harder time coping with the stark reality to what we were taught and we see then finally accepting it. It's called conditioning.

A person who's born into a country where's it is in a state of war constantly would be conditioned to that way of life and would have have less qualms/issues with being violent to others compared to a person who was raised in the states and conditioned to not even defend themselves. I think that the mental unstabliness of US soldiers is an adverse effect of that. Before you try to say that the US is always in a state of war, american society doesn't experience war in person. There's a world of difference between witnessing and living it in person compared to watching it on cnn for a few mins. Anyway, the suicides are likely their way of coping with what they experienced and not being able to conform back into society. I consider US troops mentally soft but I don't mean that as a slur but rather as a point of fact when you compare the stock (people) where those troops come from compared to people in other countries that are at war alot.

In cause you still want to debate that US troops are soft and that likely leads to them having more mental issues afterwards, do you know what stress cards are?



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vivster on 30 May 2017

Because Trump doesn't care.



If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

Aeolus451 on 30 May 2017
pokoko said:

This is a hard one to get a handle on.  It's 21 percent higher than civilians.  How much is linked directly with being in the military and how much has to do with recruiting people with a higher risk?  Is it because of service or is it because of people having trouble adjusting when they leave?  Not enough information in these little news blurbs, really.

Also, what's with the comments about the government trying to keep this quiet?  This is literally an article about the government releasing the results of a study on the problem--a problem which has been reported on many times in the past.  

Aeolus451 said:
1. People have become softer because society condemns any violence even when it's justified. We've become so sensitive to it that a lot of people have trouble coping with carrying it out. Testing to see if a person mentally able to handle it before putting them into a combat role would be the easiest way around the oversensitive people.

2. Lack of proper healthcare for vets.

Btw, obama tried to do away with vets' healthcare but people got mad at him so he downgraded the military's healthcare instead.

At least read the article.

"And roughly 65 percent of all veteran suicides in 2014 were for individuals 50 years or older, many of whom spent little or no time fighting in the most recent wars."

And what's the lack of proper healthcare?  70 percent of those who committed suicide were not regular users of VA healthcare.  What exactly do you think they should do about it?

Also, reputable source on Obama trying to "do away with vets' healthcare".

I was in a hurry earlier, trying to get a post in before dinner. Where's the link to the study so I can look at this myself? I didn't see one in the article or the name of the study. He did lower the healthcare for the military but I was wrong about obama doing away with vets healthcare completely.

 



WolfpackN64 on 30 May 2017
Aeolus451 said:
WolfpackN64 said:

So people commit more suicide because they're softer? Violence when it's justified? Tell me, how many justifiable wars has the US joined in the last 10 years? Seems like you don't really appreciate your veterans.

I appreciate them fine but I prefer to be honest and practical about what is causing this sort of stuff. I'll elaborate a bit more. American society bashes violence all the way from the weakest form of it to the highest. In other words, as a general rule, modern society conditions us to not be violent with the aim to erase violent tendacies from people (not possible) but it sensitizes them to it. When we have to commit violence, our minds have a harder time coping with the stark reality to what we were taught and we see then finally accepting it. It's called conditioning.

A person who's born into a country where's it is in a state of war constantly would be conditioned to that way of life and would have have less qualms/issues with being violent to others compared to a person who was raised in the states and conditioned to not even defend themselves. I think that the mental unstabliness of US soldiers is an adverse effect of that. Before you try to say that the US is always in a state of war, american society doesn't experience war in person. There's a world of difference between witnessing and living it in person compared to watching it on cnn for a few mins. Anyway, the suicides are likely their way of coping with what they experienced and not being able to conform back into society. I consider US troops mentally soft but I don't mean that as a slur but rather as a point of fact when you compare the stock (people) where those troops come from compared to people in other countries that are at war alot.

In cause you still want to debate that US troops are soft and that likely leads to them having more mental issues afterwards, do you know what stress cards are?

I guess I see your point more now.

In any case, the US could use an adventure abroad less.



numberwang on 30 May 2017

Not just because of war... Japan is still leading the statistics (if the statistics are really comparable in cases between suicide and accidental death)



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Aeolus451 on 30 May 2017
WolfpackN64 said:
Aeolus451 said:

I appreciate them fine but I prefer to be honest and practical about what is causing this sort of stuff. I'll elaborate a bit more. American society bashes violence all the way from the weakest form of it to the highest. In other words, as a general rule, modern society conditions us to not be violent with the aim to erase violent tendacies from people (not possible) but it sensitizes them to it. When we have to commit violence, our minds have a harder time coping with the stark reality to what we were taught and we see then finally accepting it. It's called conditioning.

A person who's born into a country where's it is in a state of war constantly would be conditioned to that way of life and would have have less qualms/issues with being violent to others compared to a person who was raised in the states and conditioned to not even defend themselves. I think that the mental unstabliness of US soldiers is an adverse effect of that. Before you try to say that the US is always in a state of war, american society doesn't experience war in person. There's a world of difference between witnessing and living it in person compared to watching it on cnn for a few mins. Anyway, the suicides are likely their way of coping with what they experienced and not being able to conform back into society. I consider US troops mentally soft but I don't mean that as a slur but rather as a point of fact when you compare the stock (people) where those troops come from compared to people in other countries that are at war alot.

In cause you still want to debate that US troops are soft and that likely leads to them having more mental issues afterwards, do you know what stress cards are?

I guess I see your point more now.

In any case, the US could use an adventure abroad less.

I agree with that. The UN can handle things for a bit. 



gatito on 30 May 2017

Because war is a business and boys don't cry. This world is effed up.



etking on 30 May 2017
vivster said:
Because Trump doesn't care.

Trump cares a lot about veterans. This is why the vast majority voted for him.



Jpcc86 on 30 May 2017
etking said:
vivster said:
Because Trump doesn't care.

Trump cares a lot about veterans. This is why the vast majority voted for him.

Does he, tho?



Arminillo on 30 May 2017
konnichiwa said:
m0ney said:
That number is very hard to believe

Same, so I had to look it up and find out that the numbers are true hence also the reason why I post it.

Take this into account and its not as hard to believe. It is counting deaths in combat past 1999, so it is of a pool of X-many soldiers.

But it is counting the suicide of every veteran past 1999. So instead of that X Pool of soldiers, it is also accounting for Veterans of Korea, WW2, Vietnam, and the like who took their own lives after 1999. Id wager there are about double the amount of that X sample in the new pool of Pre-1999 war veterans. Maybe more.



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