WagnerPaiva said:
So in short, you would still hate God, because your readings of the bible make you think God is the vilain of it, that murder, rape and torture for fun. I do not take away the right of understanding the way you do, but I would like to make a few considerations. The Bible tells a complete history, each chapter deals with a particular subject, or even particular era in history. So, if we would create a timeline, it will go like this: Creation - The first Temptation - The falling of man - The promisse of redemption: This happens in the very first 4 chapters, so, through the 39 books of the OT you have a clifhanger, the waiting for the redemption God promissed, when he talked about the consequences of choosing to not trust Him. We also stablish two things: Lucifer invented lying and God can not lie. Lucifer´s falling is described later in Isaiah and Ezekiel and his M.O is detailed in Job. The reason of this falling is detailed in the Letters of Paul, spoil alert: It was pride, he wanted to be God. So, after that we have: - The promisse to Abhraam, the Exodus of Moses, the Kingdom of God (Israel), the Judges, the royal line of David, the decadence of Israel and, finally, the prophets. The murders you mentioned are, of course, part of the wars of conquest to stablish Israel Kingdom. And in no moment God laughed or found pleasure in these wars, but they where necessary. And the rest of the world belonged to the host of heaven, not god, the fallen angels. All of this is in the book, to believe or not is a choice, but, as I said, to simplify it is not possible. So, all the murder and violence is the consequence of the very first time we turned our backs to the real source of all life and light, and because now this world belongs to satan, till the final act of this epic. We are not automata, we all have real freewill, but God, knowing everything, is not hostage in this amazing history: in the end every single piece will fit where He wants, because there is no stopping God. The rageful greed Judah acted by choice, but also served his purpose, so did Hitler and any evil person. Cause there is no rebellion that can really harm God. What is the meaning of it all, according to the Bible. To realize that we are sinners, evil, and left to our own devices, our destiny would be doom. Being born again is this realization, followed by a newfound love and trust in God´s escape pod for all this desolation: the Lord Jesus Christ. God´s plan of salvation is the only perfect way to redeem people that really trully love Him BY CHOICE, not because of fear. Because we see all around people that hate Him. The born again fear His mighty, but love and trust Him deeply. A born again christian loves God so much that he is thankful for every breath God gives to him, and he realizes we are not deserving of any of God´s gifts, but we do deserve wrath. This sounds disgusting to the unbeliever, and it is written that it must be this way in scripture. It is all there, there is absolutelly nothing not written. The endless genealogy old Earth theories, the sciences objections that would give atheists a moral stand to deny God, it is all in prophecy. This is, of course, our belief. One can deny it, but to oversimplify it is not wise at all, because it is not a simple text, neither it is a product of a dumb mind. the 40 authors of the Holy Bible where, at least the most impressive minds of the planet, or, they were inspired by God himself. So, you have to understand what is going on in each chapter, what era is in effect. It is like I tell you that your grandfather killed 57 people. Then you tell me I am a liar and your father is no murder. Then I tell you he is no murder, the 57 people were nazi soldiers and your grandpa was a GI in World War 2, he liberated a camp were 8000 jews would be executed. So, you have to understand the context. God said that He take no pleasure in the death of the one that dies, so to say he does is a lie. And the only thing He can not do is lying and abiding in evil. The very things that give power to the evil one and his angels. This, of course, is religion, one can just think it is a lie. But, it does belong in a lore that makes absolute sense in itself, and even if it was a work of fiction, any contradictions would be a product of not understanding it correctly, because, as a narrative, it is flawless, the most impressive work of art ever made. Specially when you think the authors took 5000 years to write it, in different eras and places. One can think it is all a lie, but to attack the integrity of the text is just partial understanding. |
I respect that you took the time to write all that you did here, and for that reason I will adress your points specifically. But please be aware that all of this takes an assumption that I find ridiculous. That is to say, finding any credibility on a book of tales from middle age ignorant sheepherders and their infantile ways of making sense of what they found to be a scary world. That without science to explain the most basic of phenomena we know today (like germ theory for example) they were left with only their imagination to create gods and devils, angels and demons, and a way to make themselves find some comfort in facing their own mortality.
So with that said:
1- I am well aware of the mythology of the JHWH or Jehwah or Jeovah or as the current christians call it, God with a capital G (which always sounded quite presumptuous to me, there have been plenty of gods throughout history, why the hell should they pretend their special snowflake god is anymore special than the rest)
2- Your assertion that Lucifer created lies... In your own religion, your god created everything. Not just rainbows, butterflies and nutella, but also cancer, diarrhea and Justin Bieber. The people who made up that religion also made up their god to be all knowing, all good and all powerful. Not to bore people with it here I would just recommend you'd read up a little on the "problem of evil". It should be a good way to at the very least realize why that specific Abrahamic god can not exist.
3- If any of these supernatural entities actually existed, what exactly makes you think that the 'good guy' is actually this JHWH? How do you know that in that supposed cosmic battle the good guy actually lost and you are now worshipping the evil one? Because it's written in a book?
4- So using your WW2 example, if the nazis had won the war, don't you think they would make sure to write the books in a way to make them look like the heroes and everyone else the bad guys? Are you aware that the Jewish hatred that Hitler spewed actually has it's roots in christianity and how they made the entire Jewish people the 'bad guys' for supposedly killing their 'savior'? Do you know that Jewish people actually weren't able to own land and had to be stuck with what was considered 'unholy' works, like moneylenders (bankers)?
5- If you hear some 'voices' in your head telling you it's god, how do you actually know if it really is god? how do you know it's not the devil? how do you know it's not aliens? how do you know it's you on magic mushrooms?
6- do you think something is good just because 'god' tells you it's good? again, how do you know the book you're following doesn't actually come from the 'devil'?
7- actually if you have read the bible you wouldn't have said the authors were brilliant in any way. it's terribly written, with an absolute innane narrative, full of contradictions on the story and in which most of the time it's spent namedropping whose son of whom owed something to the X, son of Y, first born of Z. Just randomly open the bible and read a few verses and you'll see what I mean. The only people who think the bible is written wonderfuly are people who have never actually f'n red it. It's full of plot holes everywhere (as you would expect from the ramblings of uneducated people making shit up as they went and telling those stories orally from generation to generation)
8- finally, just to not get even longer than we went, no I don't hate that god anymore than I hate mickey mouse. it's a myth, a fanfiction, a story, much like thousands of gods story that people made up throughout the world. as a character in a fiction I find it extremely dull in all honesty.
