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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Metroid needs (and deserves) a reboot. Caution - Lots of gifs!

Samus Aran said:
TheLastStarFighter said:
Samus Aran said:

Metroid is NOT Splatoon and NOT Batman. If you can't see the difference between Splatoon and Metroid then I don't know what to tell you. Splatoon wouldn't work well in first person view because of the squid mechanic. Since you switch a lot between "kid" and squid "mode" it would get very disorienting if the camera had to switch between first person and third person mode. Turning into the morph ball in Metroid Prime isn't disorientating as you don't need to switch between it that often and usually during quiet moments of the game (and even then the developers struggled a lot with putting this mechanic in). Splatoon is also a pure shooter, it doesn't require a lock-on button like Metroid, it doesn't have strafing.

Metroid's roots lie with 2D side-scrollers and I have no problem with Nintendo making more Metroid games like that. A third person 3D Metroid game however has nothing to do with the Metroid roots.

Even Nintendo has acknowledges that there are two different types of Metroid games: first person adventure and 2D side-scroller. They wanted to continue those two types, they said nothing about that crappy third person game that we call Other M.

I've played Arkham City, it does nothave scan logs, it tells most of its story through voice acting and interaction between Batman and the rest of the cast (villains and good guys alike). Metroid is most definitely about isolation, it's what makes the atmosphere as great as it is.

This is cool looking:

This looks like it came from the power rangers:

LOL.

-Splatoon has transformation between Kid and Squid for fast travel.  I'm trying to think of another game that has transformation between two forms, one where you are a human character and can shoot and stuff and another where you go down to the ground and can move quickly and stuff...  I know there is another game that did that first, but I can't think of what it was... Darn, it just eludes me.  One thing I do know though, in whatever game it was, it would surely be disorienting if you switched between first- and 3rd-person with the transformation.  Better keep it in third person.

-Why are you talking about Arkham City.  I never brought up that game.  You're confused.

Either you can't read or you didn't read my post. Either way you got exposed. Try reading beyond what you bolded.

Some of you guys have no clue about game design...

So now you are just avoiding the fact that Metroid has a similar form transformation to Splatoon and you never played the game that I said is a great modern interpretation of Metroid. Got it. You're hilarious. 



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TheLastStarFighter said:

So now you are just avoiding the fact that Metroid has a similar form transformation to Splatoon and you never played the game that I said is a great modern interpretation of Metroid. Got it. You're hilarious. 

Is it really that hard to actually read a post before you quote someone?

I guess so.



Samus Aran said:

What's next? First Person Zelda? Real time Pokémon rpg? First person Mario? 2D Splatoon game?

Third person shooters are in? Good thing that Metroid isn't a shooter. And FPS completely dominate third person shooters anyway, so according to your logic Metroid needs to remain first person.

Fusion has one of the best stories in the franchise, just because you hate it doesn't mean jack shit really. Metroid's canon is hardly a mess if you ignore Other M. The only "problem" is Ridley that constantly returns when he's killed, but I wouldn't mind if they killed him off for good, he's overrated. He adds nothing to the Metroid franchise. Let's keep returning villains for franchises that have non-sensical stories (Mario, Kirby).

Even Nintendo acknowledged that there are two types of Metroid games that need to be taken care off. Yeah, two, not three. I guess now you're going to ignore Nintendo's statements because it suits you? You were pretty sure Nintendo was going digital only based on a patent issued by them.

If Metroid wants to become more mainstream it's probably going to need online multiplayer. I'm fine with that as long as it doesn't come at the cost of the SP.


You said that Metroid's roots are 2D side scrolling.

You said that Mario's roots are 2D side scrolling. And this series did a succesful jump to 3D third person.

But then, you said that it's ok for Mario to get from 2D to 3D third person. But it's not for Metroid, because... nothing.



Some of the things you said in this thread don't make an ounce of sense.



spemanig said:

My thoughts on what what Metroid should be going forward has evolved since last year, so i decided to make a new thread.

I honestly think that Fusion and Zero Mission is where Metroid started wrong. The absolute worst decision was to canonize the manga. They should have hired competent writers to actually compose a back story for Samus that follows the way she was characterized in the series thus far. If any franchise deserves a reboot, its Metroid. Just get some good writers and start over. Do it right this time. I'm all for a Metroid game where Samus is better characterized, but it should be more like System Shock 2, Bioshock, Half-Life 2, and hell even games like Dark Souls and Bloodborne, and less like Uncharted or Metal Gear, which is what Other M was clearly trying to emulate. (not slagging those franchises, just saying that Metroid shouldn't tell its story the way games like those do) Samus is clearly not a talkative character, so keep her quiet and pensive. She can speak, but only when she has something of consequence to say, which, if the game is done right, should not be often. And when she does speak, her personality should reflect the character she's been built up to be. Very much like Ellen Ripley from Alien. Samus should not be exploring an area populated by lively characters bursting with gimmicky personality and monologues, and she should have little reason to talk back to them. Not just Other M, but Prime 3 suffered from this.

 

If there are NPCs in the game, they should be like characters in a Souls game or, again, Bloodborne. There to lend credence to the overall dreary tone that Metroid should hold above all else. They build the world, and that's it. No witty banter. Just dreary, even sarcastic, dialog. If you've been following the indie game Ghost Song, they have it nailed perfectly. It's inspired by Super Metroid, and it absolutely nails the atmosphere while adhering to modern advancements in game design like voice acting and story.

Not sure how to embed this video of Ghost Song. ^^^

Everything should be voice acted and instead of the outdated Prime way of scanning everything to read endless flavor text, there should be the equivalent of Audio Logs throughout the environment. Most of the information your receive should be visual, though. Once you see a federation trooper stabbed through the heart by something, you don't need a piece of scanned info reiterating that yes, this is a federation trooper and yes, it was indeed pierced by something. Samus can hack computer for world building flavor text, but that should be a rare occurrence and not nearly come up as often as they did in the Prime series. They are much better ways to build a world, as mentioned above.

In a Metroid reboot, Mother Brain should be a Shodan-like (even Glados-esque, minus the humor) villain. Cold, calculated, and intelligent. There should be genuine fear built up to the final showdown with Mother Brain, and that should be built throughout the events of the game. She is, far and away, the most interesting and underutilized villain in the Metroid franchise. Ridley is nothing more than a pirate captain, and shouldn't be treated as anything more than any other monster.

Metroids should be scary again, because they aren't anymore. They are a far-cry from what they were before, and that's because we never fight anything other than their larval states. In Alien, face huggers are just the babies. Imagine if every Alien movie after only had face huggers. We should be fighting Zeta Metroids by the middle of the game, and they should be the equivalent of Big Daddy fights in Bioshock. Extremely powerful, fast, and aggressive and extremely difficult to defeat without proper planning before hand. Most importantly, they should be fucking scary. You should see one and shit your pants. Hell, you should even see an infant Metroid and still be scared a little by the end.

Hello Shine Spark. Hello third person combat. This is what Metroid is suppose to be.

And most importantly, drop the first person perspective for a reboot. Prime had its time, and it's over. That story is done. For a reboot, make it a third person shooter platformer. Metroid was originally a 2D action platformer, so the transition to 3D should be in third person. Splatoon and games like Infamous: Second Son prove that a game like this would work from a gameplay perspective. You can be a platformer while keeping an adult aesthetic; Infamous prooves that. Just go for a realistic, retro futuristic art direction similar to the one found in Alien: Isolation, only obviously the setting would be changed to being on an alien planet, and keep the loading screens as well hidden as they were in Prime and Super. Throw the map on the bottom screen, and its a rap.

This is how the Zero Suit should look, by the way. Not the gross, sexualized, magical girl animu suit she has now. And that's it should even exist at all.

Also, I doubt there's any way to make a truly convincing, truly scary Metroid game nowadays without the game having graphic violence, which means a mature rating. If they can do it without having the game be rated M, by all means. But if keeping the franchise Rated T keeps it from being what it should be, go for the M rating. Metroid was inspired heavily by Alien, a rated R movie. Metroid become an M rated franchise is not at all a stretch.

Make the level design feel like you're exploring a complex underground tunnel system rather than a series of connected rooms. Instead of shooting colored doors to progress, create more organic barriers for progression. Hardware is more than powerful enough now for that sort of thing. And please keep the games running at 60fps.

I think with Metroid they actually have the ability to expand upon the story and universe so there is no point in rebooting. As you said, with good writers, they could just expand instead of rewriting it. Although, I'm also in the minority that enjoyed Other M so.....



Gotta figure out how to set these up lol.

Samus Aran said:
TheLastStarFighter said:
 

So now you are just avoiding the fact that Metroid has a similar form transformation to Splatoon and you never played the game that I said is a great modern interpretation of Metroid. Got it. You're hilarious. 

Is it really that hard to actually read a post before you quote someone?

I guess so.

I read it, you referenced the wrong game and forgot that Metroid has the same transformation mechanic as Splatoon and now you are avoiding discussing the topic. Cheers to your defeat Ole chap!



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Dusk said:

I think with Metroid they actually have the ability to expand upon the story and universe so there is no point in rebooting. As you said, with good writers, they could just expand instead of rewriting it. Although, I'm also in the minority that enjoyed Other M so.....


Eh...

...There not much I can say, then. No good writer can fix what Other M, Zero Mission, and fusion did to the canon. They aren't magicians. Like in Star Wars, you just can't write around "nano machines."

This is so much worse than nano machines.



Hynad said:
Samus Aran said:

What's next? First Person Zelda? Real time Pokémon rpg? First person Mario? 2D Splatoon game?

Third person shooters are in? Good thing that Metroid isn't a shooter. And FPS completely dominate third person shooters anyway, so according to your logic Metroid needs to remain first person.

Fusion has one of the best stories in the franchise, just because you hate it doesn't mean jack shit really. Metroid's canon is hardly a mess if you ignore Other M. The only "problem" is Ridley that constantly returns when he's killed, but I wouldn't mind if they killed him off for good, he's overrated. He adds nothing to the Metroid franchise. Let's keep returning villains for franchises that have non-sensical stories (Mario, Kirby).

Even Nintendo acknowledged that there are two types of Metroid games that need to be taken care off. Yeah, two, not three. I guess now you're going to ignore Nintendo's statements because it suits you? You were pretty sure Nintendo was going digital only based on a patent issued by them.

If Metroid wants to become more mainstream it's probably going to need online multiplayer. I'm fine with that as long as it doesn't come at the cost of the SP.


You said that Metroid's roots are 2D side scrolling.

You said that Mario's roots are 2D side scrolling. And this series did a succesful jump to 3D third person.

But then, you said that it's ok for Mario to get from 2D to 3D third person. But it's not for Metroid, because... nothing.



Some of the things you said in this thread don't make an ounce of sense.

Because Mario and Metroid are two totally different genres: one is a game with many shooter elements while another is a platformer. How many good first person platformers have you played? Precisely.

It's common sense that Metroid went first person and Mario went third person. Miyamoto knew this and he was a key figure in both franchises' jump to 3D.



Samus Aran said:

Because Mario and Metroid are two totally different genres: one is a game with many shooter elements while another is a platformer. How many good first person platformers have you played? Precisely.

It's common sense that Metroid went first person and Mario went third person. Miyamoto knew this and he was a key figure in both franchises' jump to 3D.


Metroid is a platformer. Stop playing around. They're the exact same genre, only Metroid has action elements and connected levels. Miyamoto doesn't know best. He's responsible for Star Fox Adventures.



spemanig said:
Samus Aran said:

Because Mario and Metroid are two totally different genres: one is a game with many shooter elements while another is a platformer. How many good first person platformers have you played? Precisely.

It's common sense that Metroid went first person and Mario went third person. Miyamoto knew this and he was a key figure in both franchises' jump to 3D.


Metroid is a platformer. Stop playing around. They're the exact same genre, only Metroid has action elements and connected levels. Miyamoto doesn't know best. He's responsible for Star Fox Adventures.

Metroid is its own genre. No one but you considers it a platformer. None of the games even have tricky platforming elements. The main elements are exploration, isolation, power-ups and shooting.



Samus Aran said:
spemanig said:
Samus Aran said:

Because Mario and Metroid are two totally different genres: one is a game with many shooter elements while another is a platformer. How many good first person platformers have you played? Precisely.

It's common sense that Metroid went first person and Mario went third person. Miyamoto knew this and he was a key figure in both franchises' jump to 3D.


Metroid is a platformer. Stop playing around. They're the exact same genre, only Metroid has action elements and connected levels. Miyamoto doesn't know best. He's responsible for Star Fox Adventures.

Metroid is its own genre. No one but you considers it a platformer. None of the games even have tricky platforming elements. The main elements are exploration, isolation, power-ups and shooting.

All elements that can be made well in third person 3D.

Roots of Metroid is third person 2D side scrolling. Not first person. It made the jump to first person quite masterfully. But there is absolutely no reason why it couldn't or shouldn't be able to go third person 3D. Your lack of arguments in that regard speaks volume. 

Your argument, so far: "It can't go from third person side scrolling to third person 3D because it didn't go this way first when the series made its jump to 3D! Third person 3D for Metroid games doesn't make sense because I like the "FPA" format, so it's the only valid way to make the series in 3D!"


*rolleyes