Nintendo's responsible for pretty much all the growth in this industry for the generation.

Besides, there are plenty of 3rd parties who've banked on Wii.  Sega, Hudson, Capcom, Activision, Ubisoft, LucasArts, Disney, Atlus, MTV, THQ... and not exclusively with casual games either.

The only 3rd party I can think of who really bet big on Wii and did awful as a result was Marvelous, and they (1) said it wasn't due to the platform but rather their own mishandling and lack of promotion and (2) they also started faltering on DS/PSP at the same time, and all their PS3/360 games have utterly tanked too.

As far as I can see, Wii does not even have 50% market share. Market would not be dead without wii, people would have bought other consoles... or are you saying that wii does not compete with hd consoles?

Using logic from some other poster on this thread, if there wasn't HD-consoles there would be only 84m sold consoles this gen. Nowhere near the 190 million figure what last gen had.

Or how about comparing market leader with market leader, second place console with second place console and third place console with third place console?

Wii is 60m short of the 145m sales of PS2, 360 is 26m ahead of Xbox, PS3 is 25m ahead of GC. Looks like HD consoles are the ones responsible with the market growth! :O

Anyway, what of the "credible" games of those 3rd party companies on wii have saved them? I guess you can name a lot, since you agree that wii singlehandedly saved the gaming...

Or how about actually looking at each company's growth?

PS2's 145m to PS3's 45m

Xbox's 24m to 360's 51m

GC's 22m to Wii's 85m

... now again, where are we seeing vast majority of growth this generation?  And where exactly is the decline?

Define what's a "credible" game for me please?   I honestly have no clue what that means?  Anything besides boring non-games like Cooking Navi, Wii Fit or Heavy Rain? ;)

And nowhere did I say Wii "saved gaming".  That's an inherently ridiculous statement that you're putting in my mouth. 

It is how you want to see it, isn't it? ;)

I don't know the definition, I thought you had read the post I was replying to before you commented. Those statements can be found on the post by Dv8thwonder.

lol.  Yes, I look at an actual company's growth as just that.  How else should I "want to see it" exactly?

And newsflash, I'm not Dv8thwonder. <3

Yes, you do just that. You look at how the company has grown. That is not the same as industry growth.

Well, I am sorry that I assumed that you were actually taking part in the conversation on hand. You know, like people usually do if they comment on posts.

The industry is made up of companies, charting their growth (or decline) is how you arrive at industry growth (or decline).  Not that hard.  And even if you want to do a superficial "market leader" comparison, Wii's still well ahead of PS2 at this point in each's cycle anyway... it's up all around then.  So once again, how should I "want to see this" exactly?  The one way that has to compare different companies over different relative periods to arrive at Wii somehow being a decline?  "Want to see" indeed. ;)

And I was taking part in the conversation.  A conversation involves listening to what's actually said though, that seems to be something you could use some work on.

How is it superficial? It is far less superficial than just to assume that because one company has grown, it has made the industry grow. You have to think about the big picture. How many of that 60m growth are actually expanding the industry?  How many of those people are the people who bought PS2 last gen?

I guess you don't know that answer and yet you are willing to say that all of those 60m are growing the industry. I just gave you another way to look at it. Both are equally wrong and it is really up to you how you want to see it. I am not telling you how you should see it.

I feel exactly the same way about you. That petty comment of yours just reinforces my  initial thoughts about you.

Taking part in the conversation would require to know what the people are really talking about. You clearly failed on that one.

The last figure we had was a Neilsen survey, which said 70% of Wii owners also owned a PS2.  Of course this relates only to the US market, and other surveys (from both Neilsen and NPD) have shown that multiconsole ownership is dramatically higher this gen than last, though Wii also has the smallest proportional percentage of multiconsole owners (while PS3 has the largest).  Either way, it shows decent growth for the entire industry on Nintendo's part, though not as massive as the GC to Wii increase would indicate.  There's no actual decline that can be attributed to Nintendo at this stage though, that rests pretty much entirely on Sony's epic fall with PS3.  Microsoft's made decent gains too, though I don't think they're really expanding the industry significantly (other than possibly cannibalizing some of the PC gaming marketplace)... it's far more likely Nintendo brought more actual "new" consumers into the market of the two.

Japan's a different story, though that's attributable to market wide shifts in consumer tastes (ie: handhelds have taken over).  Even still, Wii managed a semi-respectable hardware figure and some amazing top software sales (it's top 10 even outperforms SFC, PS1 and PS2).  And again here, we've seen the significant declines come from Sony's end, with Microsoft making a modest (if ultimately inconsequential) gain.  

Europe we really don't have enough data about to really have any good insight on, though it's really the first generation Nintendo's success there has been comparable to what they've managed in America and Japan (even NES and SNES never passed 10m in Europe afaik), and while PS3's obviously way down from PS2, both it and 360 are wildly outpacing the pathetic figures GC and Xbox managed in the region. This is the first generation where Europe's really had 3 truly viable consoles, which is something that America managed first in the previous generation.

And lol at the rest.  If you're just going to continue insulting me after stuffing words in my mouth, I guess our "conversation" here is over.