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Forums - General Discussion - Mafia Round 14 - Game Thread

Words Of Wisdom on 07 March 2010
trangentspree said:

WoW says: "lol no, let's vote for everyone that isn't me"

This is pretty lazy for you. If we don't follow your advice, will you threaten to get yourself modkilled again?

Nah, if all 3 killing sources were still alive today then maybe. 

Getting the C-family's last player and only having one nightkill last night gave the town a chance at victory.  It's a small one, but it's there and I'm going to fight for it.

 

Also, I'd like to point out to everyone that I am currently the only townie that cannot be nightkilled (as the mafia keep finding out).  Lynching me is the only way the mafia/SK can get rid of me.  Lynching me is screwing over the town.  Anyone pushing to lynch me is scum.  It's that simple.



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dsister44 on 07 March 2010

Could someone update the chart? =) Please and thank you



KingFate on 07 March 2010
Words Of Wisdom said:
trangentspree said:

WoW says: "lol no, let's vote for everyone that isn't me"

This is pretty lazy for you. If we don't follow your advice, will you threaten to get yourself modkilled again?

Nah, if all 3 killing sources were still alive today then maybe. 

Getting the C-family's last player and only having one nightkill last night gave the town a chance at victory.  It's a small one, but it's there and I'm going to fight for it.

 

Also, I'd like to point out to everyone that I am currently the only townie that cannot be nightkilled (as the mafia keep finding out).  Lynching me is the only way the mafia/SK can get rid of me.  Lynching me is screwing over the town.  Anyone pushing to lynch me is scum.  It's that simple.

I don't like that attitude, but there isn't much I can really do. The people will either trust your roleclaim or they won't. That being said I do not like how you choose the lynch order for the town. The best way is for people to make up their mind is to pressure people who are being silent.



PSN ID: KingFate_

trangentspree on 07 March 2010
Words Of Wisdom said:
trangentspree said:

WoW says: "lol no, let's vote for everyone that isn't me"

This is pretty lazy for you. If we don't follow your advice, will you threaten to get yourself modkilled again?

Nah, if all 3 killing sources were still alive today then maybe. 

Getting the C-family's last player and only having one nightkill last night gave the town a chance at victory.  It's a small one, but it's there and I'm going to fight for it.

 

Also, I'd like to point out to everyone that I am currently the only townie that cannot be nightkilled (as the mafia keep finding out).  Lynching me is the only way the mafia/SK can get rid of me.  Lynching me is screwing over the town.  Anyone pushing to lynch me is scum.  It's that simple.

Do you know how ridiculous this sounds?

People began voting for you at the start of Day 4 and you responded with a threat to remove yourself from the game. When that didn't work out for you, you completely changed tact and decided that you did want to play after all and that you were in fact ready to roleclaim. And as far as I'm concerned your 'small victory' is irrelevant as it's a personal victory for you whether you're scum or not, because it would always be a good move for you to get rid of your competitors. But let's look at your modkill post.

Right now I'm considering asking to be modkilled because I'm fairly unhappy with the way this game has turned out.  The problem is that the ratios are likely 6 townies / 1 SK / 4 mafia.  If Falcon095 and I go away (assuming Falcon095 is town) then it's down to 4 townies / 1 SK / 4 mafia.  Assume 1 mislynch and 3 non-mafia T players dead and the game is over as that mafia T family with 3 people is the winner with 3 / 5.  So depending on what happens today, the game could be over tomorrow morning.  Even if only one person is modkilled then it's still a win for the mafia with 3 / 6.

I kind of want to be modkilled, but any more innocent modkilling screws the town.

I don't understand your logic here at all. You seem to be saying that you are thinking about getting yourself modkilled because with the odds the town might be facing it would screw the town over if one more townie got himself modkilled? Aside from the whole idea of wanting to leave a game just because you think you are about to lose being utterly pathetic, this just reads like 'stop voting me or I'll modkill myself.'

And as for your roleclaim - isn't it ironic that you claim to have powers of invincibility that essentially break the game right after spinning an argument that the town is unfairly disadvantaged? If you do have the ability to protect yourself, I think it is because you are the SK.

And as for that - it's the return of the classic 'lynch me and you'll be sorry!' fallacy.



Words Of Wisdom on 07 March 2010
KingFate said:

I don't like that attitude, but there isn't much I can really do. The people will either trust your roleclaim or they won't. That being said I do not like how you choose the lynch order for the town. The best way is for people to make up their mind is to pressure people who are being silent.

Normally I agree, however it seems like almost every vgC game I've been in lately has had more scum/scum night kills than days to lynch scum.

The result is that the end of the game ends up as a race to double-lynch all the unconfirmed players before we run out of days (people).  Ideally, what I want to see is a game with fewer night-kills.  If the town can lynch scum every day, the town should win before the scum can kill them all.  The town should also get 2-3 mislynches as room for failure.  Then there's no race to the finish.

Your sentiments are right for a normal mafia game.  Rushing the lynch is actually scummy in normal play as it's typically done to end the day quickly without discussion.  You're not wrong to suspect me and you're not wrong to think the game should be played differently.  Reread my earlier posts in the thread and that's how the game should be played.

Right now the best solution (and most likely victory) solution for this game is simply to play it by the numbers double lynching the most viable candidates which I keep making tables of.  If anything, it's unfair to the scum because we can play the numbers and they can't nightkill me to stop it.  Still, a win is a win.  If you're pro-town and interested in seeing your team win then pay attention because this is how we do it.



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trangentspree on 08 March 2010
Words Of Wisdom said:
KingFate said:

I don't like that attitude, but there isn't much I can really do. The people will either trust your roleclaim or they won't. That being said I do not like how you choose the lynch order for the town. The best way is for people to make up their mind is to pressure people who are being silent.

Normally I agree, however it seems like almost every vgC game I've been in lately has had more scum/scum night kills than days to lynch scum.

The result is that the end of the game ends up as a race to double-lynch all the unconfirmed players before we run out of days (people).  Ideally, what I want to see is a game with fewer night-kills.  If the town can lynch scum every day, the town should win before the scum can kill them all.  The town should also get 2-3 mislynches as room for failure.  Then there's no race to the finish.

Your sentiments are right for a normal mafia game.  Rushing the lynch is actually scummy in normal play as it's typically done to end the day quickly without discussion.  You're not wrong to suspect me and you're not wrong to think the game should be played differently.  Reread my earlier posts in the thread and that's how the game should be played.

Right now the best solution (and most likely victory) solution for this game is simply to play it by the numbers double lynching the most viable candidates which I keep making tables of.  If anything, it's unfair to the scum because we can play the numbers and they can't nightkill me to stop it.  Still, a win is a win.  If you're pro-town and interested in seeing your team win then pay attention because this is how we do it.

I wish I had a greasy handshake GIF for just such an occasion. This is incredible.

Also: this is just plain contemptible.



Words Of Wisdom on 08 March 2010
trangentspree said:

I don't understand your logic here at all. You seem to be saying that you are thinking about getting yourself modkilled because with the odds the town might be facing it would screw the town over if one more townie got himself modkilled? Aside from the whole idea of wanting to leave a game just because you think you are about to lose being utterly pathetic, this just reads like 'stop voting me or I'll modkill myself.'

And as for your roleclaim - isn't it ironic that you claim to have powers of invincibility that essentially break the game right after spinning an argument that the town is unfairly disadvantaged? If you do have the ability to protect yourself, I think it is because you are the SK.

And as for that - it's the return of the classic 'lynch me and you'll be sorry!' fallacy.

I already answered your question in the response.  With 3 sources of nightkills, there were not enough days to lynch all the scum.  Combine pretty much zero hope of victory with a dwindling interest and there's enough to warrant just stepping away from the game.  However, with trashleg (and her mafia's) demise... there's still hope for a town victory.  We're down to 2 nightkills (the factions won't make the mistake of targeting me again sadly) and there are enough days to win by the numbers.  The game's course turned around just that fast.

As for what you think, I don't really mind at this point.  I'm 99.9% sure you're scum.  You've been pushing to lynch me since you found out you couldn't nightkill me.  I bet it pisses you off something fierce that I'm standing between you and a mafia win, and now you're trying everything you can to get me lynched.  I respect that.  As mafia, it's what you need to do.  Understand, though, that I'm doing my best to stop you and I'm going to keep doing my best.

Yesterday, I fought trashleg to the end and she flipped scum.

Today, I will fight you to the end and you will flip scum.



KingFate on 08 March 2010
Words Of Wisdom said:
KingFate said:

I don't like that attitude, but there isn't much I can really do. The people will either trust your roleclaim or they won't. That being said I do not like how you choose the lynch order for the town. The best way is for people to make up their mind is to pressure people who are being silent.

Normally I agree, however it seems like almost every vgC game I've been in lately has had more scum/scum night kills than days to lynch scum.

The result is that the end of the game ends up as a race to double-lynch all the unconfirmed players before we run out of days (people).  Ideally, what I want to see is a game with fewer night-kills.  If the town can lynch scum every day, the town should win before the scum can kill them all.  The town should also get 2-3 mislynches as room for failure.  Then there's no race to the finish.

Your sentiments are right for a normal mafia game.  Rushing the lynch is actually scummy in normal play as it's typically done to end the day quickly without discussion.  You're not wrong to suspect me and you're not wrong to think the game should be played differently.  Reread my earlier posts in the thread and that's how the game should be played.

Right now the best solution (and most likely victory) solution for this game is simply to play it by the numbers double lynching the most viable candidates which I keep making tables of.  If anything, it's unfair to the scum because we can play the numbers and they can't nightkill me to stop it.  Still, a win is a win.  If you're pro-town and interested in seeing your team win then pay attention because this is how we do it.

The other lynches you influenced, save thrashleg have been innocent townies. Also, putting me at the bottom of the list, when I was the person suspecting you seems like are you trying to win me over. I just can't get behind this whole "I am the most important townie now!". If it were up to me I'd double lynch you and axum. Sadly the rest of the group doesn't have the same feelings I have.



PSN ID: KingFate_

Words Of Wisdom on 08 March 2010
KingFate said:

The other lynches you influenced, save thrashleg have been innocent townies. Also, putting me at the bottom of the list, when I was the person suspecting you seems like are you trying to win me over. I just can't get behind this whole "I am the most important townie now!". If it were up to me I'd double lynch you and axum. Sadly the rest of the group doesn't have the same feelings I have.

How do you feel about trangentspree?  He sure seems to share your feelings.



trangentspree on 08 March 2010
Words Of Wisdom said:
trangentspree said:

I don't understand your logic here at all. You seem to be saying that you are thinking about getting yourself modkilled because with the odds the town might be facing it would screw the town over if one more townie got himself modkilled? Aside from the whole idea of wanting to leave a game just because you think you are about to lose being utterly pathetic, this just reads like 'stop voting me or I'll modkill myself.'

And as for your roleclaim - isn't it ironic that you claim to have powers of invincibility that essentially break the game right after spinning an argument that the town is unfairly disadvantaged? If you do have the ability to protect yourself, I think it is because you are the SK.

And as for that - it's the return of the classic 'lynch me and you'll be sorry!' fallacy.

I already answered your question in the response.  With 3 sources of nightkills, there were not enough days to lynch all the scum.  Combine pretty much zero hope of victory with a dwindling interest and there's enough to warrant just stepping away from the game.  However, with trashleg (and her mafia's) demise... there's still hope for a town victory.  We're down to 2 nightkills (the factions won't make the mistake of targeting me again sadly) and there are enough days to win by the numbers.  The game's course turned around just that fast.

As for what you think, I don't really mind at this point.  I'm 99.9% sure you're scum.  You've been pushing to lynch me since you found out you couldn't nightkill me.  I bet it pisses you off something fierce that I'm standing between you and a mafia win, and now you're trying everything you can to get me lynched.  I respect that.  As mafia, it's what you need to do.  Understand, though, that I'm doing my best to stop you and I'm going to keep doing my best.

Yesterday, I fought trashleg to the end and she flipped scum.

Today, I will fight you to the end and you will flip scum.

Let's pick you apart a bit and see what gives.

@ This is what you actually said.

The problem is that the ratios are likely 6 townies / 1 SK / 4 mafia.  If Falcon095 and I go away (assuming Falcon095 is town) then it's down to 4 townies / 1 SK / 4 mafia.  Assume 1 mislynch and 3 non-mafia T players dead and the game is over as that mafia T family with 3 people is the winner with 3 / 5.

You promoted the idea that were 4 mafia still alive at this stage, you did not know this (unless of course if you had inside knowledge). This is the worst case scenario, and it relies on TruckoSaurus creating a game where there were 9 scum to start with which I think seems obscene.

Your justification is based on the presumption that you and Falcon are both townies, and that Falcon was to be removed with you (this was soley in response to TheRepublic suggesting the idea of him being removed - nothing else).

Also, Day 3 certainly turned into a lackluster game. But by Day 4 things had begun to pick up again, partially because of the interest in you, so this point is irrelevant.

Also this still doesn't justify why you thought it was acceptable to request to be modkilled simply because you thought the town was in a losing situation?

@ You seem to thrive on scare tactics and taunts. Let's not forget how many townies have been lost to the town because of how much you've enjoyed pummeling players this game. Unlike others you might not find me so easy to mislynch.

[edit - this is also a fallacy. I don't think you're going to convince anyone that I suddenly jumped on you out of nowhere during this game. I've been following you very closely since Day 1]