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Forums - Microsoft - Datel suing Microsoft over Max Memory card lockout

gravess on 24 November 2009

I just think locking out the memory cards that were already in the marketplace is kinda a dickhead move from MS. Not only does that company lose a ton of money(i know that was MS point) but it rips off tons of consumers that bought them before the bannings. If i went to gamestop and bought the cheaper version of something i shouldnt be penalized. Thats like not making madcatz controllers work because you want your overpriced ones to sell. I understand that MS doesnt really care about these kinda things cause people eat up their products like hot cakes no matter what but I just see this as bad PR. Just seems like they are on a mission to piss people off anymore.



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dsister44 on 24 November 2009
masterb8tr said:
nightsurge said:
So once again you are telling me that any product at all is open for you to do whatever you want with? Why would anyone sell products in Norway if they are never protected for their investment?

When i have bought the product I can do what i want with it( unless its breaking the law obviously). Why do they care what the customers do with their product after purchase? If i want to combine my 360 with a dishwasher i have every right to do so... If my usage of the product is illegal(pirating ect) then obviously i am breaking law, and can be convicted.

That is way off topic. You can do whatever you want with the console you bought. Just a company can't develop whatever they want. But if you do something with your console that Microsoft doesn't want you to do. They just aren't going to pay for it 



masterb8tr on 24 November 2009
dsister44 said:
masterb8tr said:
nightsurge said:

So you are saying that no company is allowed to stop you from doing anything to any of their products in Norway?  I call bull.

Weak argument much=?After you've purchased their product, the product is  yours to do whatever you want with . Companies can in some cases make som changes in your product/the agreement after you bought it, however a one-sided change in a agreement like such is rarely approved.

Yes, you can do whatever you want with your console. But a company does not have the right to make an unapproved product. Microsoft has the right to deny it. It is not right for a company to make a profit on Microsoft's console without paying anything to them

Things are not that simple. Yes Microsoft has every right to change the design of their consoles so it doesnt accept modchips ect(as long as it doesnt cause monopoly issues) If i however can make a modchip that works on the 360, i can sell it to customers without giving MS a cent, as its not based on their technology. Its all about licenses and patents. Take cell phones for example. Usually you get the cellphones cheaper if it comes with a subscription to a telecompany. The phone will usually be locked to only work with that telecompany's simcards. Its not illegal however to make a program that removes this simcard lock.



Mistershine on 24 November 2009
gravess said:
I just think locking out the memory cards that were already in the marketplace is kinda a dickhead move from MS. Not only does that company lose a ton of money(i know that was MS point) but it rips off tons of consumers that bought them before the bannings. If i went to gamestop and bought the cheaper version of something i shouldnt be penalized. Thats like not making madcatz controllers work because you want your overpriced ones to sell. I understand that MS doesnt really care about these kinda things cause people eat up their products like hot cakes no matter what but I just see this as bad PR. Just seems like they are on a mission to piss people off anymore.


Kind of like only MS being able to make wireless controllers.



masterb8tr on 24 November 2009
dsister44 said:
masterb8tr said:
nightsurge said:
So once again you are telling me that any product at all is open for you to do whatever you want with? Why would anyone sell products in Norway if they are never protected for their investment?

When i have bought the product I can do what i want with it( unless its breaking the law obviously). Why do they care what the customers do with their product after purchase? If i want to combine my 360 with a dishwasher i have every right to do so... If my usage of the product is illegal(pirating ect) then obviously i am breaking law, and can be convicted.

That is way off topic. You can do whatever you want with the console you bought. Just a company can't develop whatever they want. But if you do something with your console that Microsoft doesn't want you to do. They just aren't going to pay for it 

1. I did not make the comment that cause this to go off topic.

2. What Ms doesnt want me to do with my console is irrelevant. Its not their console after all. If i bought the ps3 because i needed a dvdplayer and i knew it played dvds. Sony couldnt come later on and remove the dvd-functions because they want people watching blu-rays instead. If i bought the console and modded it, its not MS right to update the console later on and ruining my modchip. Ban me from xboxlive? sure, xboxlive is a service which i dont own, but something i pay for to use.



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dsister44 on 24 November 2009
masterb8tr said:
dsister44 said:

Yes, you can do whatever you want with your console. But a company does not have the right to make an unapproved product. Microsoft has the right to deny it. It is not right for a company to make a profit on Microsoft's console without paying anything to them

Things are not that simple. Yes Microsoft has every right to change the design of their consoles so it doesnt accept modchips ect(as long as it doesnt cause monopoly issues) If i however can make a modchip that works on the 360, i can sell it to customers without giving MS a cent, as its not based on their technology. Its all about licenses and patents. Take cell phones for example. Usually you get the cellphones cheaper if it comes with a subscription to a telecompany. The phone will usually be locked to only work with that telecompany's simcards. Its not illegal however to make a program that removes this simcard lock.

I still do not see what is illegal about what Microsoft is doing. There isn't a monopoly on memory cards. You just have to have it approved by Microsoft. Datel's basis for this lawsuit is wrong. You basically said it yourself



ironman on 24 November 2009
masterb8tr said:
dsister44 said:
masterb8tr said:
nightsurge said:

So you are saying that no company is allowed to stop you from doing anything to any of their products in Norway?  I call bull.

Weak argument much=?After you've purchased their product, the product is  yours to do whatever you want with . Companies can in some cases make som changes in your product/the agreement after you bought it, however a one-sided change in a agreement like such is rarely approved.

Yes, you can do whatever you want with your console. But a company does not have the right to make an unapproved product. Microsoft has the right to deny it. It is not right for a company to make a profit on Microsoft's console without paying anything to them

Things are not that simple. Yes Microsoft has every right to change the design of their consoles so it doesnt accept modchips ect(as long as it doesnt cause monopoly issues) If i however can make a modchip that works on the 360, i can sell it to customers without giving MS a cent, as its not based on their technology. Its all about licenses and patents. Take cell phones for example. Usually you get the cellphones cheaper if it comes with a subscription to a telecompany. The phone will usually be locked to only work with that telecompany's simcards. Its not illegal however to make a program that removes this simcard lock.

Mod chips have nothing to do with the topic my friend. But since you went down that road, mod chips are not illegal to sell. You can even put one in your console without any issues, heck, you can even put a Linux on the modchip..it's once you put a modded version of the MS dashboard onto the mod chip that it becomes illegal.  As for the Cell phone example, that is bogus, if you cancel your cellular plan early, often you are liable for early cancelation fees which are meant to cover the cost of the cell phone. This virtually eliminates fraud.

On both fronts you are grossly off topic, and neither point is sufficaint enough to prove anything more than the fact that you are clueless.



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Kasz216 on 24 November 2009
dsister44 said:
masterb8tr said:
dsister44 said:

Yes, you can do whatever you want with your console. But a company does not have the right to make an unapproved product. Microsoft has the right to deny it. It is not right for a company to make a profit on Microsoft's console without paying anything to them

Things are not that simple. Yes Microsoft has every right to change the design of their consoles so it doesnt accept modchips ect(as long as it doesnt cause monopoly issues) If i however can make a modchip that works on the 360, i can sell it to customers without giving MS a cent, as its not based on their technology. Its all about licenses and patents. Take cell phones for example. Usually you get the cellphones cheaper if it comes with a subscription to a telecompany. The phone will usually be locked to only work with that telecompany's simcards. Its not illegal however to make a program that removes this simcard lock.

I still do not see what is illegal about what Microsoft is doing. There isn't a monopoly on memory cards. You just have to have it approved by Microsoft. Datel's basis for this lawsuit is wrong. You basically said it yourself

Uh... actually that's still a monopoly.


Microsoft is controlling the market in that regard... it's excluding competitors on something that isn't based on fair buisness practices.  A company is making a product people want, and have been using but Microsoft has blocked them from selling it soley to profit.

In most markets Microsoft would lose that lawsuit huge.  The only reason they won't lose this one is because Intellectual property laws have gotten pretty illogical based on the fact that intellectual property is a near impossible thing to protect... (and which likely shouldn't be protected and instead sold under a different model.)



masterb8tr on 24 November 2009
ironman said:
masterb8tr said:
dsister44 said:
masterb8tr said:
nightsurge said:

So you are saying that no company is allowed to stop you from doing anything to any of their products in Norway?  I call bull.

Weak argument much=?After you've purchased their product, the product is  yours to do whatever you want with . Companies can in some cases make som changes in your product/the agreement after you bought it, however a one-sided change in a agreement like such is rarely approved.

Yes, you can do whatever you want with your console. But a company does not have the right to make an unapproved product. Microsoft has the right to deny it. It is not right for a company to make a profit on Microsoft's console without paying anything to them

Things are not that simple. Yes Microsoft has every right to change the design of their consoles so it doesnt accept modchips ect(as long as it doesnt cause monopoly issues) If i however can make a modchip that works on the 360, i can sell it to customers without giving MS a cent, as its not based on their technology. Its all about licenses and patents. Take cell phones for example. Usually you get the cellphones cheaper if it comes with a subscription to a telecompany. The phone will usually be locked to only work with that telecompany's simcards. Its not illegal however to make a program that removes this simcard lock.

Mod chips have nothing to do with the topic my friend. But since you went down that road, mod chips are not illegal to sell. You can even put one in your console without any issues, heck, you can even put a Linux on the modchip..it's once you put a modded version of the MS dashboard onto the mod chip that it becomes illegal.  As for the Cell phone example, that is bogus, if you cancel your cellular plan early, often you are liable for early cancelation fees which are meant to cover the cost of the cell phone. This virtually eliminates fraud.

On both fronts you are grossly off topic, and neither point is sufficaint enough to prove anything more than the fact that you are clueless.

Modchips has something to do with the topic... My point being Ms cant ban modchip or datels memorycard on already sold 360's, At least not in my country. They cant remove features i paid for later on. AS for the cell phone example you are clueless. It has nothing to do with cancelling the subscription to the telecompany only opening up the cellphone for other simcards. Its not fraud, hell they even run commercials on tv for that program in my country. In case you missed the point, different countries different laws..



masterb8tr on 24 November 2009
dsister44 said:
masterb8tr said:
dsister44 said:

Yes, you can do whatever you want with your console. But a company does not have the right to make an unapproved product. Microsoft has the right to deny it. It is not right for a company to make a profit on Microsoft's console without paying anything to them

Things are not that simple. Yes Microsoft has every right to change the design of their consoles so it doesnt accept modchips ect(as long as it doesnt cause monopoly issues) If i however can make a modchip that works on the 360, i can sell it to customers without giving MS a cent, as its not based on their technology. Its all about licenses and patents. Take cell phones for example. Usually you get the cellphones cheaper if it comes with a subscription to a telecompany. The phone will usually be locked to only work with that telecompany's simcards. Its not illegal however to make a program that removes this simcard lock.

I still do not see what is illegal about what Microsoft is doing. There isn't a monopoly on memory cards. You just have to have it approved by Microsoft. Datel's basis for this lawsuit is wrong. You basically said it yourself

 I basically didnt though. I didnt even discuss if Microsoft actions causes monopoly.  I am about the post you made about Microsoft right to do whatever they like with their console... Which is obviously wrong.