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Forums - General - Is the US Government pro Dictatorship?

TheRealMafoo said:
pastro243 said:
It was a coup

You can't just say it and that make it true. Why was it a coup?

Read the oter thread I posted, Im too lazy to post.



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The US government and any other government with enough power over such things for that matter are pro whatever gives them an advantage.



TheRealMafoo said:
Desroko said:
Because a democratically-elected President was removed and expelled by force, in violation of the Constitution that the coup participants claim they are protecting.

He was president, not king. You still have to follow rules. When two of the three branches of government think you did something worthy of removal, and follow all the policies put into place to perform there obligation, it's not a coup.

The President has to follow rules, but nobody else does? Both sides are acting illegally here. You talk about violating Honduras' Constitution - what they did violates it as well. Why do you only care about crimes if they're committed by the side you don't like? Is it a radical concept that some things are bad no matter who does them?

There was no due process, constitutional mechanism, or precedent for this. Honduras now has the precedent that if the military doesn't like what you're doing, it can storm your house, put a gun to your head, and boot you out of your country, without a trial. Oh, and once they're done with that, they're going to suspend the Constitution they love so dearly. You know, to protect it.



Desroko said:
TheRealMafoo said:
Desroko said:
Because a democratically-elected President was removed and expelled by force, in violation of the Constitution that the coup participants claim they are protecting.

He was president, not king. You still have to follow rules. When two of the three branches of government think you did something worthy of removal, and follow all the policies put into place to perform there obligation, it's not a coup.

The President has to follow rules, but nobody else does? Both sides are acting illegally here. You talk about violating Honduras' Constitution - what they did violates it as well. Why do you only care about crimes if they're committed by the side you don't like? Is it a radical concept that some things are bad no matter who does them?

There was no due process, constitutional mechanism, or precedent for this. Honduras now has the precedent that if the military doesn't like what you're doing, it can storm your house, put a gun to your head, and boot you out of your country, without a trial. Oh, and once they're done with that, they're going to suspend the Constitution they love so dearly. You know, to protect it.

You do realize the same thing could be done in the US right?

And to answer your question "what they did violates it as well". Oddly, the Supreme Court can not violate the constitution, because what they say IS the constitution. It's why they are above reproach, and in office for life. They are not bound to a political party, because no party has control over them.

If in the US, the Supreme Court ruled that the Constitution somehow states it's legal to kill 23 year old men in the month of May, then doing so is not a violation of the Constitution. Kind of a weird thing if you think about it. 



According to Article 239 of the honduran constitution: ‘No citizen who has already served as head of the Executive Branch can be President or Vice-President. Whoever violates this law or proposes its reform, as well as those that support such violation directly or indirectly, will immediately cease in their functions and will be unable to hold any public office for a period of 10 years.



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Article 272 of the Honduran Constitution gives the military the power to remove a president even without a court order, if he seeks to violate the term limits prescribed in the Honduran Constitution



"I like my steaks how i like my women.  Bloody and all over my face"

"Its like sex, but with a winner!"

MrBubbles Review Threads: Bill Gates, Jak II, Kingdom Hearts II, The Strangers, Sly 2, Crackdown, Zohan, Quarantine, Klungo Sssavesss Teh World, MS@E3'08, WATCHMEN(movie), Shadow of the Colossus, The Saboteur

http://narcosphere.narconews.com/thefield/honduras-whats-black-and-white-and-gets-red-out

"The now-iconic photograph of the late 19-year-old Isis Obed Murillo, being carried by his friends to seek medical help moments after his shooting by gunmen during Sunday’s demonstrations in Tegucigalpa, was also published by the Honduran daily… Except that La Prensa chose to airbrush the young man’s blood out of the photo.
Media that literally whitewashes the story to this extreme, of course, is not shut down, destroyed or attacked by the coup regime. That treatment is reserved only for real journalists."

I'm confused. I thought that the dictator had been exiled.



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famousringo said:
http://narcosphere.narconews.com/thefield/honduras-whats-black-and-white-and-gets-red-out

"The now-iconic photograph of the late 19-year-old Isis Obed Murillo, being carried by his friends to seek medical help moments after his shooting by gunmen during Sunday’s demonstrations in Tegucigalpa, was also published by the Honduran daily… Except that La Prensa chose to airbrush the young man’s blood out of the photo.
Media that literally whitewashes the story to this extreme, of course, is not shut down, destroyed or attacked by the coup regime. That treatment is reserved only for real journalists."

I'm confused. I thought that the dictator had been exiled.


"Just got off phone from Hunter. He was in a building at the airport with other Press types. They heard Mel was arriving. Commotion started outside and they were told to get to other end of airport. They went running outside and saw people running towards an area. He went there just as an ambulance was pulling out. Saw very large pool of blood. Told 2 to 3 dead."

"Person there told him that rocks had been thrown at soldiers and one (soldier/police)walked up to the fence and started shooting. I need to clarify that Hunter did not see this but was told this from the protesters. He has no confirmation that this is what happened. People were showing Hunter the brass and it appeared to be 5.56. He did not see any on the ground and does not know if this was from the shooter. Said everyone was scrambling around trying to find some."

"Protest organizers are trying to send people home. They do not want any more blood shed. Crowd has calmed down but it was very tense when Hunter first arrived. police/army had pulled back from fence. Few people are leaving and he said the crowd is a lot better now. He got pictures of the blood. He did not hear the shots personally."

"He did see an older man in a white shirt reach down into the blood pool and cover his hands. He then wiped them on his shirt to make it look like his blood or that he had been involved. Hunter saw what he thought was an AP photographer take the man's picture. Hunter said if you see it on the web, don't believe it. It was faked."

"He is heading back into the crowd and will update if anything warrants further coverage. Plans on posting pics and his write up when he gets back to hotel. It will be better than mine. Doing this from hastily scratched notes while confirming his safety."

 

 

On Reuters the next day:

Source: Reuters

Supporters of ousted Honduras' President Manuel Zelaya, one of them with a shirt covered with blood, talks to people next to a bullet-riddled motorbike outside the Toncontin international airport in Tegucigalpa July 5, 2009. At least one person was killed and two were badly wounded in Honduras on Sunday when protesters demanding the return of Zelaya clashed with troops at the main airport in the capital, a medical worker and emergency services at the scene told Reuters. REUTERS/Tomas Bravo (HONDURAS CONFLICT POLITICS)

If the press manipulating the news is (automatically) a sign that you're in a dictatorship, then doesn't that mean that everyone is living in a dictatorship at the moment?




Well, here in Brazil we were pretty near a communist revolution when U.S. financed a military dictatorship. Was the worst thing we ever saw here in Brazil, the repression was just too high, people just couldn't say nothing against the military state in risk of death, was the time when nature was most devastated, salaries just gone too low, the public school that used to be pretty good became shit and it is still shit nowadays, the government just took off philosophy and sociology of the scholar grade and history lessons became just memorizing numbers.

Sure U.S. financed the military dictatorship in many regions of the globe, not just here, it's pretty lucrative to than. They financed a dictatorship in Cuba(Batista), another in Brazil(Military), many in Asia and Latin America.



HappySqurriel said:
famousringo said:
http://narcosphere.narconews.com/thefield/honduras-whats-black-and-white-and-gets-red-out

"The now-iconic photograph of the late 19-year-old Isis Obed Murillo, being carried by his friends to seek medical help moments after his shooting by gunmen during Sunday’s demonstrations in Tegucigalpa, was also published by the Honduran daily… Except that La Prensa chose to airbrush the young man’s blood out of the photo.
Media that literally whitewashes the story to this extreme, of course, is not shut down, destroyed or attacked by the coup regime. That treatment is reserved only for real journalists."

I'm confused. I thought that the dictator had been exiled.


If the press manipulating the news is (automatically) a sign that you're in a dictatorship, then doesn't that mean that everyone is living in a dictatorship at the moment?


Um, this is about the government manipulating the press, not the press manipulating the news. Hence why I included those last two sentences in the quote. And by manipulating, I mean seizing control of.

http://www.reuters.com/article/latestCrisis/idUSN29399379

"Shortly after the Honduran military seized President Manuel Zelaya and flew him to Costa Rica on Sunday, soldiers stormed a popular radio station and cut off local broadcasts of international television networks CNN en Espanol and Venezuelan-based Telesur, which is sponsored by leftist governments in South America.

A pro-Zelaya channel also was shut down.

The few television and radio stations still operating on Monday played tropical music or aired soap operas and cooking shows.

They made little reference to the demonstrations or international condemnation of the coup even as hundreds of protesters rallied at the presidential palace in the capital to demand Zelaya's return and an end to the blackout."

Does the Honduran constitution also have legal provisions for cracking down on the media in the event that the military must overthrow the President?



"The worst part about these reviews is they are [subjective]--and their scores often depend on how drunk you got the media at a Street Fighter event."  — Mona Hamilton, Capcom Senior VP of Marketing
*Image indefinitely borrowed from BrainBoxLtd without his consent.