Very reasonable! I'm impressed.

Both of those games play MUCH better than GT5:P (and forza 2 plays x10 better than GT5:P too), much more enjoyable, GT5:P felt like a chore to play, let's bounce off walls, woohoo!

And yup, Forza 3 is proving itself more each day that it is going to pi*s all over GT5:P and GT5 from a great height, only sony fanboys fail to see this, funny to see though lol

Well the one problem is this.....GT5P as i've stated in a previous post is still graphically superior to what we've seen of Forza 3 so far...the only negative graphically of GT5P is the exterior environments.  GT5P has as least equal car model quality, better lighting and fixed 60fps for options including cockpit as well as being shown at a higher resolution.

Plus, going by reports, GT5 is coming a lot sooner than people think.  It's due to appear within this financial year which goes until March 2010, but it may very well appear at the tail end of 2009.

Also, don't forget that GT5P used a graphics engine that is virtually 2 years old.  It's the same engine thats powered Prologue Spec 1 since December 2007, and was probably finished a good month or two at least before that release.  I think we will see a graphic improvement in the final GT5 game.

LOL so many fanboys on this thread thats claiming victory alrdy even tho neither of these game arn't even out yet.....only thing Im sure is that there's gonna be a HUGE damage control from these fanboys once all is said and done.

...From what I have seen and heard graphically, the cars in Forza3 are FAR superior to GT5P. They are smoother, the reflections are actually MORE relistic that GT5P's cars, the shading is better, fewer jagglies, even the cockpit in Forza3 will be running at 60FPS when the game releases. I guess you don't get out much to look at REAL cars do you? Save the argument for a game that MAY actually top Forza3...and that would be GT5.

No need for personal attacks...this is all in my opinion....and yes I think that the cars look better in GT5P seeing as the lighthing model is more realistic.  Forza's model makes the cars look more arcadey...they look great though...but more arcadey.  There is no official confirmation that cockpit mode in F3 will be 60fps...Turn10 is working on it...but it was 30fps at E3 and thats all we have to go with.

I see quite a few cars on a daily basis and seeing as I live in a normally lit world where cars look very similar to the GT5P models....I don't see a more arcadey lighthing in my neck of the woods...maybe you do.

I really don't see where you get the lighting model looking better from. How do the cars in Forza3 look more "arcadey"  than GT5P? is it the "high polish" on the cars? Because that to me, makes the cars look like they were lovingly waxed and detailed, much like they would be in real life to reduce drag.

Don't get me wrong, Forza 3 looks great.  Anyway I've picked 3 images from the official Turn10 website to demonstrate the arcadey feel.

If you look at the top image, the buildings in the background have a "Uncharted" look to them.  The second image....again the out-houses and the third image entirely looks more cartoony.

I think I've worked it out...its obviously the shader that they are using...it sometimes, shades things unusually....the cars in some shots look out of this world, nice and shiny etc, but in other shots they look as if they aren't shaded well.

same comment were made by eurogamer actually, although they used the phrase clinical.

I want to make myself clear here.  I think Forza 3 looks really good.  I think Turn10 have worked wonders with the modelling and graphics compared to Forza 2.

I am just sticking my nose in because of the comments by Turn10 about best graphics, best racer and basically shooting down PD at any given opportunity.  I think the work they have done is good, but they certainly don't have the clout or experience to get away with negative digs at an established games developer with extensive knowledge of car simulation with PD.  Turn10 have only be around for like 5 years whereas PD have been around for over 10 years.