nightsurge said: MikeB said: nightsurge said: MikeB said: @ nightsurge Equal time frames would be from 1995 to 1997 and 2006 to 2008. The PS1 launched at the end of 1994, the PS3 launched at the end of 2006. Taking equal timeframes the PS3 sold 22.7 million units by March 2009. The PS1 sold 13.5 million units by March 1997. Uh, no.... did you even look at the data you so kindly provided?  You are trying to include the Japan only numbers and one full year of worldwide numbers for PS1 versus the 2 years of world wide numbers (minus 6 months of Europe). If you compare their worldwide launches, or anything even remotely reasonable (as johnsobas said, anything non-crazzyman), the PS3 is roughly 4-5 million behind the PS1 when aligned at BEST, and at worst the PS3 can be said to be behind by 8 million.   I have taken that into account, that's why I stated "about". I didn't say there weren't factors involved. The PS1 was a normal specced low priced console and had some time to build up a launch library for its US and European launch. The opposite counts with regard to the PS3. I have always said that IMO the PS3 was a far ahead of its time console. The advantage of this being exclusives like Uncharted 2 being so impressive technically, the disadvantage being immature firmware and a launch library which by far did not tap into the system's potential. This is the same as I stated around the PS3's launch regarding the state of its firmware and 1 and half years before the PS3 launched with regarding my expectations of launch titles. Let's assume, if I were a Sony blind fanboy (however note I never owned a PS2). Would I have pointed out the latter two issues? However by looking at the technology and the state of how legacy software was being written, I expected this beforehand. What issues?  You are trying to give the PS3 a handicap so that the numbers I presented don't look as bad.  And since when does "about" (which by the way you never used) equal a possible differenct of 17 million? (from 9+ to 8-). Just admit it, the fairest thing I can do for the PS3 is to compare it to Japans first 2 years and the NA/EU first two years of the PS1. That gives: PS1 - 6.5 Million in Japan from Dec 1994 to Mar 1997, 11.7 million in NA, 9.6 million in EU = 27.8 million PS3 - 22.7 from beginning end of 2006 till March 2009 A difference of the PS3 being 5.1 million BEHIND the PS1 when aligned launches.  If you account for the European delayed PS3 launch, I will take off 6 months of PS1 EU sales and the result is STILL:  PS3 being ~2.1 million BEHIND the PS1 (and that's being generous and taking off the months that included the bloated holiday sales). That is a very different picture from the one you tried to claim as the PS3 tracking 9 million AHEAD of the PS1.

@MikeB

I did account for the Euorpean delayed launch of the PS3.  I accounted for all the usable variables and still your claim was just completely wrong.

I don't complain about how the PS3 is "doing better based on aligned launches" because I understand that if the PS3 never gets that extra time at the end it won't matter, and as long as the current trends stay, the PS3 will see declining sales and will no longer be tracking higher than the 360.  But I don't want to spin you into an off-topic debate.

Why can't you admit your initial claim was based on completely skewed information and was purposely done so to make the PS3 look like it is doing a lot better than it is?  After my in depth analysis and fair comparison of aligned launches the PS3 is still ~2.1-5.1 million behind the PS1.

 

MikeB said: @ nightsurge the fairest thing I can do You could take first 2 years PS1 available for Japan + 2 years for Europe + 2 years for US (all seperate, taking into account headstarts) compared to: First 2 years PS3 available for Japan + 2 years for Europe + 2 years for US (all seperate, taking into account headstarts)

What headstarts are you talking about?  If you ignore your (headstarts) I did exactly what you are saying I could do.

This is a comparison of the PS3 to the PS1, not the PS3 in regards to the 360 vs the PS1 in regards to the N64.  I already stated I took every variable into account which can be known, including the delayed launch of the PS3 in Europe.  That is the fairest comparison and still the PS3 is tracking 2.1-5.1 million BEHIND the PS1.

Just admit your numbers were the worst sample you could use and purposely done so to make the PS3 look like it is doing better than it is?  I dropped my signature for now, but I can bring it back if you keep this up.  It really is a shame you can't just admit it when you were wrong.

 

@ nightsurge

No, I don't agree. The already far less impressive for its time PS1 technology got older nomatter the delay for other regions. It was a 2 year old console at the end of 1996, just like the PS3 was a 2 year old (but from the start ahead of its time) console by the end of 2008.

IMO the PS3 was so far ahead of its time for a console, that if it would have launched as a slimmed down version this year it would still be a solid impressively specced console for its time.

So one could also view the sales and the time developers have had to learn how to use this technology we have seen thus far as a great bonus.

MikeB said: @ Ausfalcon Uh, Mike you don't have the word "about" in the post quoted by nightsurge I already did so in the post before that he quoted.

You are a real piece of work.  So you did not say "about" where you said you said it.  But since you used the word somewhere else in a sentence in another statement you'll act like you said it in what was quoted instead?  Do you have any concept of how ridiculous that is?  I think you do, which is what makes you such the troll its not even funny.

Mike you keep trying to paint me and nightsurge as "Xbots".  Could you try for just a moment, to act your age?  Both of us, unlike you, use both consoles and enjoy both consoles.  And you know I am a Sony stockholder.  But this is a question of being truthful.  And you are not into that.  I'll keep saying it, it'd be great if your fairy tales were the reality, then maybe I'd be making more on my stock in Sony.  Also here you go switching to something else instead of resolving the debate on your PS1 vs PS3 sales comment.

If it did not contirubute to you going out of your way to constantly work the numbers and cherry-pick for the purpose of misinforming that would be fine.  Betamax looked better than VHS and failed.  Amiga was ahead of its time and failed.  Its obvious this is your attempt to do your bit for your new King and Country (Sony).  Plus if it does take off more maybe you can make more on your related business (Fun Computing).

MikeB said: @ nightsurge Why can't you admit your initial claim was based on completely skewed information No, I don't agree. The already far less impressive for its time PS1 technology got older nomatter the delay for other regions. It was a 2 year old console at the end of 1996, just like the PS3 was a 2 year old (but from the start ahead of its time) console by the end of 2008. IMO the PS3 was so far ahead of its time for a console, that if it would have launched as a slimmed down version this year it would still be a solid impressively specced console for its time. So one could also view the sales and the time developers have had to learn how to use this technology we have seen thus far as a great bonus.

Translation:

Yes my numbers were totally wrong, but FU nightsurge, I ain't giving you the satisfaction.

 

MikeB said: Yes, I love ahead of its time daring new technology (like Blu-Ray, Cell and Amiga's OS / custom chips). So what? The Amiga had a major impact on the industry regarding where rival advancements were leading, IMO similarly the PS3 paves the way for future technology advancements for consoles and PCs.

LMAO! I have really heard it all now!!!

The only thing the PS3 is going to be remembered for is for being such a disaster for Sony which could have made Sony bankrupt (it still might), there is nothing about the PS3 that is "ahead of its time", the 360 can do everything (apart from bluray which is failing anyhow) the PS3 can and in most cases better,

 

Sony are losing the console war, once this generation is over Sony will be too weak to do anything else.....

 

http://i43.tinypic.com/291dmbp.jpg

MikeB said: @ nightsurge Why can't you admit your initial claim was based on completely skewed information No, I don't agree. -- a bunch of stuff that doesn't say anything regarding why he does not agree with admiting he was wrong.

So you are saying that you were correct and fair in using 2 years of Japan data + 1 year of NA data + 1 year of EU data for the PS1 when comparing it with 2 years Japan + 2 years NA + 1.5 years EU data for the PS3?

Cmon, MikeB, please at least try to hide your misinformation better.  You gave the PS3 an extra years worth of sales practically (which would explain why in your flawed comparison the PS3 was tracking 9 million higher).

Taking into account all variables which can be used, the reality is that the PS3 is tracking BEHIND the PS1 by 2.1-5.1 million units!

 

the OP is a fanboy, biased.

He is emotinally atytacking the 360, not seeing the good things its done to the market

oh and PS3 will NEVEr outsell 360!!!

Son1x said: http://i43.tinypic.com/291dmbp.jpg

 

LOL!