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Forums - Gaming - The Greatest Enemy of the RPG Genre

griffinA on 02 May 2009
Xxain said:
Zizzla_Rachet said:
blaydcor said:
Zizzla_Rachet said:
griffinA said:
I actually like this article a lot. This is a trend that happens all the time in all types of entertainment.

For example, when rap became popular with people like Biggie and Puff Daddy there was a huge schism in the rap community over this new found recognition. Today it takes the form of "casual" listeners of rap and "hardcore" rap fans.

This same schism is happening today between "casual" gamers and "hardcore " gamers. "The casualz like games like Wii Sports, Halo, and Nintendogs when they're are MUCH better games to choose from!" The hardcore gamers cry. That's just how entertainment is.

 

FAIL!!!! Halo Is so Hardcore

Not that I want this thread to devolve into one of those debates, but Halo is easily on of the most casual games out there, in the sense that the bulk of Halo's userbase are not gamers, they are regular dudes who buy Halo, Madden, and maybe a Call of Duty or two.

 

 

This actually strenghthens the OP...There are such things as the FPS Elite...Which are the People playing WolfenStien and CounterStrike on their PC...Halo falls in with Quake and it is acurate to say that most Madden players would go to halo for a few hours of FPS...But the same can be said for Call of Duty...The fact is that the Game scence has broken down into Elite's and Generic...Or to say other wise causual and hardCore....But the fact still stands...Casuals would not spend so much time playing games...That is what defines "Hardcore" People who spend alot of time Playing games.....As for Elite and generic or "MainStream"...would I be wrong in calling Tekken Players Casual becuase I prefer Virtua Fighter?

 

I think you just won the thread, even now we are having problems on deciding on what hardcore is...maybe there is no hardcore or casuals..just a bunch of elitist who need to be separate themselves from there less active VG players

I still don't think "hardcore=people who spend alot of time playing video games" fits. Let's say a regular guy goes to work everyday and plays solitare for 4 hours a day. Is he then hardcore?

 



"Pier was a chef, a gifted and respected chef who made millions selling his dishes to the residents of New York City and Boston, he even had a famous jingle playing in those cities that everyone knew by heart. He also had a restaurant in Los Angeles, but not expecting LA to have such a massive population he only used his name on that restaurant and left it to his least capable and cheapest chefs. While his New York restaurant sold kobe beef for $100 and his Boston restaurant sold lobster for $50, his LA restaurant sold cheap hotdogs for $30. Initially these hot dogs sold fairly well because residents of los angeles were starving for good food and hoped that the famous name would denote a high quality, but most were disappointed with what they ate. Seeing the success of his cheap hot dogs in LA, Pier thought "why bother giving Los Angeles quality meats when I can oversell them on cheap hotdogs forever, and since I don't care about the product anyways, why bother advertising them? So Pier continued to only sell cheap hotdogs in LA and was surprised to see that they no longer sold. Pier's conclusion? Residents of Los Angeles don't like food."

"The so-called "hardcore" gamer is a marketing brainwashed, innovation shunting, self-righteous idiot who pays videogame makers far too much money than what is delivered."

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Zizzla_Rachet on 02 May 2009
griffinA said:
Xxain said:
Zizzla_Rachet said:
blaydcor said:
Zizzla_Rachet said:
griffinA said:
I actually like this article a lot. This is a trend that happens all the time in all types of entertainment.

For example, when rap became popular with people like Biggie and Puff Daddy there was a huge schism in the rap community over this new found recognition. Today it takes the form of "casual" listeners of rap and "hardcore" rap fans.

This same schism is happening today between "casual" gamers and "hardcore " gamers. "The casualz like games like Wii Sports, Halo, and Nintendogs when they're are MUCH better games to choose from!" The hardcore gamers cry. That's just how entertainment is.

 

FAIL!!!! Halo Is so Hardcore

Not that I want this thread to devolve into one of those debates, but Halo is easily on of the most casual games out there, in the sense that the bulk of Halo's userbase are not gamers, they are regular dudes who buy Halo, Madden, and maybe a Call of Duty or two.

 

 

This actually strenghthens the OP...There are such things as the FPS Elite...Which are the People playing WolfenStien and CounterStrike on their PC...Halo falls in with Quake and it is acurate to say that most Madden players would go to halo for a few hours of FPS...But the same can be said for Call of Duty...The fact is that the Game scence has broken down into Elite's and Generic...Or to say other wise causual and hardCore....But the fact still stands...Casuals would not spend so much time playing games...That is what defines "Hardcore" People who spend alot of time Playing games.....As for Elite and generic or "MainStream"...would I be wrong in calling Tekken Players Casual becuase I prefer Virtua Fighter?

 

I think you just won the thread, even now we are having problems on deciding on what hardcore is...maybe there is no hardcore or casuals..just a bunch of elitist who need to be separate themselves from there less active VG players

I still don't think "hardcore=people who spend alot of time playing video games" fits. Let's say a regular guy goes to work everyday and plays solitare for 4 hours a day. Is he then hardcore?

 

 

No that is called "Theft Of Service"



 



Xxain on 02 May 2009

Then what is hardcore???



griffinA on 02 May 2009
Xxain said:
Then what is hardcore???

 

 There's nothing that can be definative but my own personal definition is "someone who arranges there life around in order to play games." Regular people don't leave themselves a block of time in the day to play games, they play games when they're bored. They don't rearrange their life around games in the same way hardcore gamers do.

But going along with this definition there is no such thing as a "hardcore" game. There are games that are "upstream" and "downstream" meaning there are games that are more complex than others. For example, Strategy games and RPGs are more complex than most FPS and platformers.



"Pier was a chef, a gifted and respected chef who made millions selling his dishes to the residents of New York City and Boston, he even had a famous jingle playing in those cities that everyone knew by heart. He also had a restaurant in Los Angeles, but not expecting LA to have such a massive population he only used his name on that restaurant and left it to his least capable and cheapest chefs. While his New York restaurant sold kobe beef for $100 and his Boston restaurant sold lobster for $50, his LA restaurant sold cheap hotdogs for $30. Initially these hot dogs sold fairly well because residents of los angeles were starving for good food and hoped that the famous name would denote a high quality, but most were disappointed with what they ate. Seeing the success of his cheap hot dogs in LA, Pier thought "why bother giving Los Angeles quality meats when I can oversell them on cheap hotdogs forever, and since I don't care about the product anyways, why bother advertising them? So Pier continued to only sell cheap hotdogs in LA and was surprised to see that they no longer sold. Pier's conclusion? Residents of Los Angeles don't like food."

"The so-called "hardcore" gamer is a marketing brainwashed, innovation shunting, self-righteous idiot who pays videogame makers far too much money than what is delivered."

Xxain on 02 May 2009
griffinA said:
Xxain said:
Then what is hardcore???

 

 There's nothing that can be definative but my own personal definition is "someone who arranges there life around in order to play games." Regular people don't leave themselves a block of time in the day to play games, they play games when they're bored. They don't rearrange their life around games in the same way hardcore gamers do.

But going along with this definition there is no such thing as a "hardcore" game. There are games that are "upstream" and "downstream" meaning there are games that are more complex than others. For example, Strategy games and RPGs are more complex than most FPS and platformers.


so if one a casual becomes addicted to Halo 3 and plays for 40 hours a week is he hardcore???

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griffinA on 02 May 2009
Xxain said:
griffinA said:
Xxain said:
Then what is hardcore???

 

 There's nothing that can be definative but my own personal definition is "someone who arranges there life around in order to play games." Regular people don't leave themselves a block of time in the day to play games, they play games when they're bored. They don't rearrange their life around games in the same way hardcore gamers do.

But going along with this definition there is no such thing as a "hardcore" game. There are games that are "upstream" and "downstream" meaning there are games that are more complex than others. For example, Strategy games and RPGs are more complex than most FPS and platformers.

 

so if one a casual becomes addicted to Halo 3 and plays for 40 hours a week is he hardcore???

 

 As long as he has some sort of set date and has to rearrange his life in order to play it, then yes he is hardcore.



"Pier was a chef, a gifted and respected chef who made millions selling his dishes to the residents of New York City and Boston, he even had a famous jingle playing in those cities that everyone knew by heart. He also had a restaurant in Los Angeles, but not expecting LA to have such a massive population he only used his name on that restaurant and left it to his least capable and cheapest chefs. While his New York restaurant sold kobe beef for $100 and his Boston restaurant sold lobster for $50, his LA restaurant sold cheap hotdogs for $30. Initially these hot dogs sold fairly well because residents of los angeles were starving for good food and hoped that the famous name would denote a high quality, but most were disappointed with what they ate. Seeing the success of his cheap hot dogs in LA, Pier thought "why bother giving Los Angeles quality meats when I can oversell them on cheap hotdogs forever, and since I don't care about the product anyways, why bother advertising them? So Pier continued to only sell cheap hotdogs in LA and was surprised to see that they no longer sold. Pier's conclusion? Residents of Los Angeles don't like food."

"The so-called "hardcore" gamer is a marketing brainwashed, innovation shunting, self-righteous idiot who pays videogame makers far too much money than what is delivered."

Zizzla_Rachet on 02 May 2009
Xxain said:
Then what is hardcore???

 

A person that owns all current Gen systems is HardCore..Becuase time is Money and his/her time is spent to play video games....But you can't call a person using a single system Casual if they play Madden and Halo....RPG people can be considerd Geeks due to their taste for Fantasy.....

The fact is that Games are Evolving inside their respective genre....

And Casual gamers are people that play Sudoko and Cross Word Puzzle...Digital or Video display does not make them comparable to something Like FPS games which only work under the VIDEO GAME Classification..The Fact that things like Solitare went Digital only shows you how far technology has come...but it does not make them video games

And the Wii...The "Casual" Games on Wii Incorporate extensive uses of Video Programming and the fact that they only require a "Cusual" amount of time to play shows you that their elements where meant for quick mental exercises the difineing factor of Casual game players...MadWorld Is a parfect example...Here is a Full on Video Game in a "Casual" Market..The end Result..Great Reviews but it Bombs at retail...That was a Hardcore Video Game...

 

There are no Casual Video Gamers But Hardcore Gamers due exsist...

 



 



griffinA on 02 May 2009

@Zizzla

What? So if you're someone who plays everytype of genre and enjoys everything from FPS to RPGs, have a collection of hundreds of games, and spend 20 hours a day playing VGs BUT don't own a current-gen system they're not hardcore?



"Pier was a chef, a gifted and respected chef who made millions selling his dishes to the residents of New York City and Boston, he even had a famous jingle playing in those cities that everyone knew by heart. He also had a restaurant in Los Angeles, but not expecting LA to have such a massive population he only used his name on that restaurant and left it to his least capable and cheapest chefs. While his New York restaurant sold kobe beef for $100 and his Boston restaurant sold lobster for $50, his LA restaurant sold cheap hotdogs for $30. Initially these hot dogs sold fairly well because residents of los angeles were starving for good food and hoped that the famous name would denote a high quality, but most were disappointed with what they ate. Seeing the success of his cheap hot dogs in LA, Pier thought "why bother giving Los Angeles quality meats when I can oversell them on cheap hotdogs forever, and since I don't care about the product anyways, why bother advertising them? So Pier continued to only sell cheap hotdogs in LA and was surprised to see that they no longer sold. Pier's conclusion? Residents of Los Angeles don't like food."

"The so-called "hardcore" gamer is a marketing brainwashed, innovation shunting, self-righteous idiot who pays videogame makers far too much money than what is delivered."

Xxain on 02 May 2009

both of those definitions a bad:

Griffin what if he becomes hardcore and rearranges his life...for 1 game?? then goes back to normal??

Zizzia - what if i own all consoles, but use my PS3 for BR, Wii for family and friends, anc 360 for Halo?



Zizzla_Rachet on 02 May 2009
griffinA said:
Xxain said:
Then what is hardcore???

 

 There's nothing that can be definative but my own personal definition is "someone who arranges there life around in order to play games." Regular people don't leave themselves a block of time in the day to play games, they play games when they're bored. They don't rearrange their life around games in the same way hardcore gamers do.

But going along with this definition there is no such thing as a "hardcore" game. There are games that are "upstream" and "downstream" meaning there are games that are more complex than others. For example, Strategy games and RPGs are more complex than most FPS and platformers.

 

I beg to differ...With the execption of strategy I would Say a FPS is More Complex than an RPG since you have to be more concius of the "World" Around you to not get Fragged every spawn life...Coming up with strategies on the fly Micro mamaging your invertory in real time while trying to survive is way mor complex than having tons of times to go trough Menus and yes RPG bosses sometimes require complex stratergies to beat but Stocking at a town up or grinding before proceeding is in no way complex...Try playing Capture the Flag or even better in the mother of all...Attack and Defend in Rainbow Six Vegas that is complex my friend! and HardCore!